[22:30] <daftykins> well this is the first i've learned of this bombshell
[22:30] <daftykins> https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/oct/26/bbc-radio-2-show-vernon-kay-loses-listeners-after-ken-bruce-departure
[22:30] <daftykins> Pop Master... over...!?
[22:39] <zxmpi> who knew that the audience would follow the dj they liked?!
[22:40] <daftykins> haha
[22:40] <daftykins> i wonder if he can still do pop master or if there's a twist
[22:40] <daftykins> oh yes this piece says he does
[22:46] <daftykins> so it's possibly the unveiling of more crApple tat @ midnight, possibly including the M3 chips
[22:47] <daftykins> are you excited!?
[22:47] <daftykins> where's my regular viewing party...
[22:48] <zxmpi> yesteray i installed a shareware version of mahjongg that i last played 30+ years ago in my dos emulator on my linux systems :-)
[22:48] <zxmpi> have put together quite a little dos system on both of my linux systems
[22:48] <daftykins> oh wow
[22:48] <daftykins> i can picture playing with one - i wonder what it was
[22:49] <zxmpi> it was a great version of mahjongg. no nagware or limitations. 
[22:49] <zxmpi> playing with a mouse feels like cheating
[22:49] <daftykins> hehe
[22:49] <daftykins> oh yeah i think the one i am partially recalling was cursor keys
[22:50] <daftykins> in fact nope can't be sure
[22:50] <zxmpi> this one you typed the position of tiles like h7
[22:51] <zxmpi> https://www.dosgamesarchive.com/file/mah-jongg-solitaire/mahjongg
[22:52] <daftykins> yes that looks like what i remember!
[22:52] <zxmpi> and that is the best indication of my interest in shiny new apple stuff :-)
[22:52] <daftykins> but i feel like i had mouse control
[22:53] <daftykins> heh
[22:53] <zxmpi> it works with a mouse but 30 years ago in early dos days most people didn't have a mouse
[22:53] <daftykins> well even though their devices and policies are evil, OS is overrated and so on... what they're doing to prove Arm's value is kinda interesting
[22:54] <daftykins> ooh yes i'm just about old enough to remember
[22:54] <zxmpi> risc was always the future, just sheer inertia and intels control of the market and ms's inability to rewrite their software for other processors has stalled it to this point
[22:54] <daftykins> loved the little Apricot (4)? x86s we had early on, after the Apple II
[22:55] <zxmpi> listening to retro computing podcasts and it seems that acorn computers who gave us the arm chip also gave us the networking tech chips that qualcom now sells as their own
[22:56] <daftykins> hmm, i wonder if licenses are in place
[22:57] <zxmpi> was a great line where they were demoing the bbc to bill gates and he went to show him the builtin networking and bill said 'what's a network?'
[22:57] <daftykins> i mean i doubt they do the same job in anything like the same way, more like super vague at a monumentally high level
[22:57] <daftykins> haha yeah i remember hearing of that one
[22:58] <zxmpi> was the mid 80s. having 2 computers in a room was a rareity
[23:00] <daftykins> used to be my Dad's retirement dream to network his old apricot 486s from work days - he's retired now but i don't see any sign ;)
[23:01] <zxmpi> i worry though that as the market moves to custom silicon that generalised computing will be curtailed
[23:02] <zxmpi> here's a device with an os. you won't be able to run any other os
[23:02] <daftykins> yeah their implementation is not a nice one
[23:02] <zxmpi> we'll have to make the eu break some fingers to loosed their grip
[23:03] <daftykins> it will be interesting to me to see if they have been able to push the single-threaded performance more, since the M2 basically didn't change that over M1
[23:03] <daftykins> just need a similarly successful design to make it into production with a conventional motherboard that has slots etc
[23:04] <daftykins> i wonder if it's as simple as Qualcomm being mostly geared toward mobile only that they can't make a good design desktop part
[23:04] <zxmpi> i think qualcomm doesn't want to compete against their customers
[23:06] <daftykins> i can't quite think of who would fit as a customer of theirs that a viable desktop Arm CPU would threaten
[23:12] <penguin42> zxmpi: Hmm where does the idea that Acorn did anything for networking come from?
[23:13] <zxmpi> the bbc micro had networking builtin. it had everything builtin. was why it was so expensive. when the company folded. the arm chips and networking tech was sold off
[23:13] <penguin42> zxmpi: The networking stuff in the beeb (which was optional) was pretty basic, it was a stanard hdlc part
[23:14] <penguin42> daftykins: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2023/10/qualcomm-snapdragon-x-elite-looks-like-the-windows-worlds-answer-to-apple-silicon/
[23:14] <zxmpi> will be interesting to see more arm laptops around
[23:15] <zxmpi> as long as i can bung on linux that is
[23:17] <zxmpi> otherwise they're as useful as windows rt laptops
[23:46] <penguin42> full Windows 11 on ARM these days as far as I understood it
[23:47] <daftykins> penguin42: i did vaguely see a bit about that one but i always gather qualcomm's chips are weak
[23:47] <penguin42> daftykins: Why?
[23:48] <daftykins> seen devs always say they're potatoes for performance
[23:49] <penguin42> hmm, I'd thought they were pretty good
[23:50] <daftykins> certain'y not first-hand comments on my part
[23:50] <daftykins> heh not sure how l became '
[23:59] <zxmpi> performance can be very subjective. i get by 90% of the time in a text editor and a browser. i never edit video or audio or play games needing an expensive gpu