[00:04] <webchat36> nah. No dice from that. I'm trying  reinstalling *everything* (with dpkg --get-selections and apt-get install --reinstall) as a last ditch
[01:41] <infogulch> I'm trying to compile an application that requires valgrind/cachegrind.h, but it's not present in /usr/include/valgrind/ even though the valgrind package is installed. I'm on 22.04
[01:51] <arraybolt3> infogulch: It doesn't appear there's any package in Ubuntu that provides that file.
[01:52] <oerheks> https://github.com/smparkes/valgrind/blob/master/callgrind/callgrind.h
[01:52] <oerheks> oh just a test, ignore
[01:53] <arraybolt3> *any package in Ubuntu 22.04 I mean
[01:53] <arraybolt3> Based on the description of the package KCacheGrind, I'm guessing cachegrind was replaced by callgrind.
[01:53] <arraybolt3> In which case the code you're trying to compile probably needs to be compiled with older dependencies or needs updated.
[01:54] <arraybolt3> I could be wrong about that though.
[01:55] <infogulch> thanks, yeah I'll have to talk to contact the devs on that one
[01:55] <oerheks> yes, that missing package dates back to 16.04
[01:57] <arraybolt3> I can't find any official statements that cachegrind was ever obsoleted or anything but it does seem to be rather old and I can't find any up-to-date info about it in my initial searches.
[01:58] <oerheks> many valgrind.h bugfixes https://fossies.org/linux/valgrind/NEWS
[01:58] <oerheks> 31 okt 2023
[01:58] <arraybolt3> It seems to still exist in upstream Valgrind...
[01:58] <arraybolt3> including cachegrind.h
[01:58] <arraybolt3> infogulch: Perhaps you can build Valgrind from source?
[01:59] <oerheks> and if building fixes things, file an SRU ?
[02:00] <infogulch> I'm using a library that uses cachegrind.h directly; so maybe just copying the header into /etc/include/valgrind will be enough
[02:00] <oerheks> .. there is #valgrind-dev here on #libera
[02:02] <infogulch> I wonder why it's not included in the valgrind apt package
[02:02] <oerheks> i cannot find the reason too
[02:10] <infogulch> oh cachegrind.h may be extremely new ... "Cachegrind Client Request Interface available since Valgrind 3.22" ... which was released days ago xD
[02:10] <oerheks> yes
[02:11] <oerheks> but no, there are bugfixes in 3.22 ..
[02:11] <oerheks> no mention why that module was not available..
[02:14] <infogulch> it was added on sept 9th, and 3.22 was released on oct 31... 5 days ago. https://sourceware.org/git/?p=valgrind.git;a=history;f=cachegrind/cachegrind.h;h=ddc10abe597f1346ea9b57f5849e2d0ac7b42523;hb=HEAD
[02:14] <infogulch> current valgrind packaged by ubuntu is valgrind-3.18.1
[02:14] <oerheks> https://fossies.org/linux/valgrind/NEWS
[02:14] <oerheks> jups
[02:15] <oerheks> and LTS does not want to change to newer versions because features, but for this i suggest do file for SRU
[02:15] <oerheks> !sru
[02:15] <oerheks> there is a part if you feel all of us need this version due to bugfixes
[02:16] <oerheks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
[02:16] <oerheks> .. which it seems, imho
[05:36] <en1gma> i just put ubuntu 23.10 amd64 desktop (daily build) on my 128GB usb stick using startup disk creator from a running 23.10 box. does it create a persistent partition where it saves your work automatically? i see it created a 119GB ext4 writable partition. is that the persistence partition?
[05:40] <oerheks> good question
[05:40] <oerheks> persistence as just data/driver storage, or added programms too
[05:41] <en1gma> added programs too
[05:41] <en1gma> mostly all my custom settings i do the desktop and firefox and power but packages i install too would be nice
[05:42] <en1gma> programs is not 100% needed as i can just grab those
[05:44] <en1gma> i get my m.2 tomorrow so i took mine out tonight so i guess its not really a big deal at all. just being picky
[05:44] <en1gma> guess i will see on my next boot up
[05:44] <en1gma> thanks though
[07:16] <sn27> cek
[09:23] <paul424> hello, again I amon the very same laptop as yesterday -- broken sound asus x555lj
[09:23] <paul424> problem is when I do sudo apt install ubuntu-restricted-extras
[09:24] <paul424> it proposes very few codecs
[09:24] <paul424> what DO I do wrong /
[09:24] <paul424> and to be exact --- last time I installed large bunch of codecs -- the entire machine hanged
[09:39] <paul424> again what codecs do I need to install ?
[09:40] <paul424> for my asus x555lj ?
[09:40] <paul424> hopefully nothing hangs this time , cause I use a separate irc program -- hexchat ...
[09:40] <lotuspsychje> paul424: before installing packages, try to find the root cause of why your sound doesnt work
[09:41] <lotuspsychje> paul424: a good start is sharing your dmesg with the volunteers
[09:41] <lotuspsychje> and your details
[09:41] <lotuspsychje> !details
[09:41] <Lion-O> command line diagnostic tool to understand why ubuntu is slow...
[09:42] <elias_a> Lion-O: Are you asking for such a tool?
[09:42] <lotuspsychje> define slow Lion-O
[09:43] <elias_a> Lion-O: If you are asking, first step would be using command top in CLI.
[09:43] <Lion-O> elias_a, yes
[09:43] <paul424> I did that yesterday, and we end up in noticing that there are no codecs for the device which serves the internal speaker
[09:43] <Lion-O> lotuspsychje - You try to unlock after screen locked and it doesn't respond for ~5 minutes
[09:43] <elias_a> Lion-O: Check the memory and cpu consumption of processes with top.
[09:43] <paul424> lotuspsychje, this alsa-debug shell script ... I cannot get to it cause I am on U live version and dont have accessto what was before
[09:44] <lotuspsychje> paul424: the volunteers dont know what happened yesterday, try to restate where you left, and steps already tryed too
[09:44] <paul424> so this alsa debug script is ...
[09:45] <Lion-O> I need a monitoring tool that will sample all important PC resources in real time because CPU load and RAM load are constantly changing
[09:45] <Lion-O> It's not slow all the time. Just after some time
[09:46] <Lion-O> If I will not find such tool maybe I will create one
[09:46] <Lion-O> But before I create such tool I want to know if such exists
[09:46] <paul424> why top is bad for you  /
[09:46] <paul424> ?
[09:47] <Lion-O> top might be good if I could check what were the values after a reboot
[09:47] <Lion-O> Sometimes the PC is slow to a halt
[09:47] <Lion-O> Then I don't even got the chance to run top
[09:47] <Lion-O> Thats why
[09:51] <paul424> http://alsa-project.org/db/?f=c2e0c083b9fbac447399bfee54ab93aef99e594c here's my link , lotuspsychje
[10:10] <paul424> should installing Ubuuntu on hard disc change something ? In the way it should have a woking sound .............
[10:11] <webchat36> welcome back, paul424. i'm NOT an expert in this subject but here are some thoughts. First, the dmesg output is missing today - your earlier report at https://alsa-project.org/db/?f=b7a31ef4df8c0b1bcb8f1abaeabc1896ff49525a has it.  The current alsa report says that you have pulseaudio and stuff available. Might help later. I remember you said that
[10:11] <webchat36> the sound was also a problem in Windows? Maybe try this sequence of diagnostics: First, in a terminal, type `aplay /dev/urandom` to generate noise. Keep that running. Next, install `pavucontrol` and have a look at your sinks/streams/whatever - is an application called `aplay` making noise? Can you shunt it over to the onboard soundcard? Are all
[10:11] <webchat36> devices unmuted, and do the VU meters on both program and soundcard fill up? Can you push the sound out through the HDMI device or some other device? When trying to push it out through the correct soundcard, does plugging in a set of external speakers (or headphones) help? Sorry if these are braindead suggestions.Pulse has been the way for the last
[10:11] <webchat36> ten years or so and will hopefully confirm the nature of the problem. I don't know whether to move back to alsa or forward to pipewire diagnostically if my assumption is incorrect
[10:12] <paul424> webchat36, thanks, lets try onething at a tmie
[10:12] <paul424> a time
[10:12] <elias_a> Lion-O: What is wrong opening CLI and running top right after (re)boot?
[10:12] <paul424> aplay /dev/urandom does not work at all.
[10:13] <elias_a> Lion-O: Easy way to save the data top shows you: screenshot.
[10:16] <paul424> hmm  pavucontrol does not has the peek up of sinks/streams/whatever
[10:16] <webchat36> paul424: that's a good (or not so good) start. how does it not work? if it's not installed... i believe it's in `alsa-utils`. so you'd say something like `sudo apt install alsa-utils` and then invoke aplay
[10:16] <paul424> are you sure it should have / webchat36
[10:16] <webchat36> let me try this myself >.<
[10:16] <paul424> webchat36, in the way it is present but I dont here any sound.
[10:16] <paul424> the cmd is valid
[10:18] <paul424> webchat36, ???
[10:18] <webchat36> yeah definitely.... on my system, in the playback tab i have a program called "PipeWire ALSA [aplay] : ALSA Playback" SCREAMING with 100% noise... In output devices I have "Built-in Analog Stero" through "Line Out (plugged in)" port also at 100% noise. That's what I'd expect. Verily, if that's not happening for you then something is probably rather
[10:18] <webchat36> whack
[10:19] <Lion-O> elias_a , What would be the point of that after a reboot? Whatever caused the PC to reach the slow state is already gone after a reboot
[10:19] <paul424> I don't even have playback tab
[10:20] <paul424> ahh there IS !
[10:20] <paul424> but it shows 100% ....
[10:22] <paul424> what makes me worried the worst , is that there is this "Dummy Output" as output device
[10:23] <paul424> Can you push the sound out through the HDMI device or some other device?
[10:23] <paul424> hmm should headphones do the job?
[10:25] <webchat36> so, on the playback tab, IF you have a list entry for the aplay noise and it's controllable through pulse, THEN you SHOULD have a little dropdown box on the right hand side of the list entry which says something like "on 'Built-in Audio Analog Stereo'" or "on 'Dummy Output'" and you should be able to pick somewhere else to send it.
[10:26] <webchat36> Sure though, if it's being sent to the correct device already then try throwing some good old headphones in
[10:29] <elias_a> Lion-O: Well... you said it gets slow after some time. I presumed it is faster after reboot. My bad.
[10:33] <paul424> naah plugging external headphones does not help at all, they are good btw ---Ive just tested them on another computer
[10:35] <webchat36> ;( that's me out of ideas for now. i guess that codec thing was the right track. it's great that you're thorough with this =D
[10:36] <paul424> so what do I do to have alll necesserily codecs?
[10:38] <paul424> webchat36, ?
[10:38] <paul424> sudo apt install ubuntu-restricted-extras proposes only few ....
[10:38] <paul424> and I know it should be a lots of them ....
[10:41] <webchat36> i dunno, sorry. tomreyn seemed like the guy with big ideas here; i'm just some random internet guy who's never had big problems with sound
[10:43] <paul424> tomreyn, then ? :)
[10:46] <elias_a> Lion-O: There seems to be some misunderstanding here. My suggestion: reboot and start top in CLI. Take screenshots. When the computer slows down, compare the present values seen with top with the values right after reboot.
[10:47] <elias_a> Lion-O: In my case the reason is almost always Firefox or other FF derivative browser reserving but not freeing memory.
[11:21] <tomreyn> in case paul424 returns: they should just do a proper installation, install all pending updates and reboot and see if that helps.
[11:25] <Lion-O> Thanks elias_a but I am looking for a diagnostic tool that might be able to figure out these reasons for its own. Of-course I can do what you suggested - thanks
[13:24] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[13:26] <qfive> Hello
[15:25] <marc|gonzalez> Hello, I recently upgraded to Ubuntu 22.04, and seeking is broken in the multimedia player VLC (the program aborts and dumps core)
[15:25] <marc|gonzalez> I went to the #videolan channel, and they told me they need a backtrace.
[15:26] <lotuspsychje> marc|gonzalez: wich vlc version is that
[15:26] <marc|gonzalez> I found https://ubuntu.com/server/docs/service-debuginfod and export DEBUGINFOD_URLS="https://debuginfod.ubuntu.com"
[15:26] <marc|gonzalez> lotuspsychje: VLC media player 3.0.16 Vetinari (revision 3.0.13-8-g41878ff4f2)
[15:26] <marc|gonzalez> https://paste.debian.net/1297168/
[15:26] <ravage> marc|gonzalez: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vlc/+bug/2042743
[15:26] -ubottu:#ubuntu- Launchpad bug 2042743 in vlc (Ubuntu) "Assertion !p->parent->stash_hwaccel failed at src/libavcodec/pthread_frame.c:671" [Undecided, Confirmed]
[15:26] <marc|gonzalez> https://paste.debian.net/1297199/
[15:27] <marc|gonzalez> ravage: yes that bug
[15:27] <marc|gonzalez> I was gonna post the same link :)
[15:27] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez: sudo apt remove vlc ; sudo snap install vlc
[15:27] <marc|gonzalez> Is VLC no longer natively supported? :(
[15:27] <respawn> i am on 3.0.20
[15:27] <leftyfb> snaps are native to ubuntu
[15:28] <marc|gonzalez> Containerization is not quite native
[15:28] <marc|gonzalez> I had several issues with firefox snap, I went back to the PPA
[15:28] <ravage> so wait for someone to fix the bug, compile it yourself or use the snap
[15:28] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez: oh, sorry, I was under the impression you were interested in maybe trying a newer version of vlc which might resolve your issue
[15:28] <marc|gonzalez> ravage: this is what I'm doing
[15:29] <marc|gonzalez> I started vlc under gdb and "Enable debuginfod for this session? (y or [n]) y"
[15:29] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez: try the snap
[15:29] <JanC> ravage: people tried to compile themselves & that didn't fix it
[15:29] <ravage> the snap works
[15:30] <JanC> so something else must be different in the snap...
[15:30] <marc|gonzalez> Even though debuginfod is enabled, it's not downloading the symbols for /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libavcodec.so.58
[15:30] <ravage> well. it does not usw hw accelleration. at least not on my nvidia card
[15:30] <JanC> that would also explain why it doesn't crash, LOL
[15:30] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez: the snap version does not have the bug
[15:31] <marc|gonzalez> It downloaded 330 debug symbol files, but apparently libavcodec.so.58 is missing
[15:31] <marc|gonzalez> leftyfb: thanks I'll consider this work around
[15:31] <marc|gonzalez> But I'd like to solve the debug lib issue
[15:32] <JanC> the snap version probably has the same bug, it's just that hwaccel probably doesn't work inside the snap
[15:32] <JanC> ?
[15:32] <ravage> I can't prove it but that is my assumption too
[15:33] <ravage> But I also disabled acceleration on the Deb version
[15:33] <ravage> Still crashes
[15:33] <ravage> With X11 Output selected
[15:34] <ravage> First I blamed the ESM package
[15:34] <ravage> But exists in the non esm package too
[15:35] <marc|gonzalez> Is there a channel to discuss debuginfod issues? :(
[15:35] <lotuspsychje> !discuss
[15:38] <marc|gonzalez> Maybe I can try disabling HW acceleration on the command line
[15:38] <Zoob> I'm unable to install cisco packet tracer on Ubuntu 23.10 because the Dependency "libgl1-mesa-glx" is not satisfiable
[15:40] <leftyfb> Zoob: I would recommend reaching out to Cisco for support with their 3rd party application
[15:40] <Zoob> Alright, thanks
[15:41] <JanC> that package has been deprecated for many years
[15:42] <JanC> Cisco aren't the only 3rd party company that were too lazy to update their package dependencies for that one...
[15:46] <marc|gonzalez> JanC: ravage: leftyfb: disabling HW accel does work around the issue `vlc --avcodec-hw=none`
[15:47] <JanC> to me it looked like VLC is trying to use hardware acceleration incorrectly & that's why it crashes
[15:48] <JanC> (but I'm not an expert on that)
[15:49] <lotuspsychje> marc|gonzalez: maybe you can add that test as comment on the bug ID
[15:49] <marc|gonzalez> The VLC devs have asked me for a backtrace, but I can't generate one because I can't download the lib symbols
[15:49] <marc|gonzalez> lotuspsychje: I will, yes!
[15:49] <lotuspsychje> tnx
[15:50] <lotuspsychje> you filed this upstream too marc|gonzalez ?
[15:50] <lotuspsychje> or just talking with the devs in chat?
[15:50] <marc|gonzalez> lotuspsychje: depends what you mean by "filed". I've been discussing the abort in #videolan and #ffmpeg
[15:51] <lotuspsychje> ah ok nvm then
[15:51] <JanC> Zoob: Cisco need to use 'libglx0' instead of or as an alternative dependency to 'libgl1-mesa-glx'
[15:53] <JanC> does ffmpeg have that bug too?  mpv doesn't have it (for me)
[16:05] <Guest42> hello. I am attempting to boot the latest Ubuntu LTS installer on an old computer with UEFI. I have been able to get Knoppix to boot. however, the machine's BIOS doesn't recogize my flash drive as containing anything it can boot when I image the Ubuntu installer to it.
[16:06] <Guest42>  I meant to write: old computer WITHOUT UEFI
[16:16] <LnxGnome> Guest42: did you boot Knoppix with the same flash drive?  have you tried a smaller flash drive?
[16:18] <Guest42> LnxGnome: I used the same flash drive for Knoppix, yes. I imaged it the same way as well. the drive'
[16:18] <Guest42> drive's capacity is 32GB.
[16:18] <JanC> Guest42: does that computer even support 64-bits?
[16:19] <Guest42> JanC: yes, it does. it's not that old
[16:20] <JanC> it must be pretty old if it has no UEFI
[16:20] <Guest42> maybe 15 years?
[16:20] <Guest42> it's old but it still works, so I am (trying to) put it to work
[16:20] <JanC> must have been one of the last computers without UEFI...
[16:21] <Guest42> I actually don't know for sure that it doesn't have it. could I check from within windows 10?
[16:21] <Guest42> I just assumed
[16:22] <JanC> I assume you can see it in Windows but I don't know how  :)
[16:22] <Guest42> time for Google then
[16:22] <JanC> it might have UEFI running in BIOS emulation mode also (that's something you can change in the firmware setup)
[16:23] <Guest42> I saw nothing in the firmware setup menus about UEFI, BIOS or Legacy
[16:23] <Guest42> I guess that's why I assumed no UEFI.
[16:24] <LnxGnome> Guest42: what kind of CPU does it have? Model#?
[16:24] <JanC> it might be called "CSM" in the firmware setup also
[16:25] <JanC> I suppose 15yo can be BIOS-only
[16:25] <Guest42> I saw nothing about that. also, looking through what I assume is a windows installer log, suggests BIOS as well
[16:25] <JanC> 12-15y ago is when the switch-over happened
[16:25] <Guest42> "Callback_BootEnvironmentDetect: Detected boot environment: BIOS"
[16:26] <Guest42> this is also a cheaper machine. probably not any fancy new features on here. no bluetooth
[16:29] <JanC> it might be possible to boot an old-style USB boot stick that works, and then use that one to boot the Ubuntu one
[16:29] <marc|gonzalez> lotuspsychje: I've updated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vlc/+bug/2042743
[16:29] -ubottu:#ubuntu- Launchpad bug 2042743 in vlc (Ubuntu) "Assertion !p->parent->stash_hwaccel failed at src/libavcodec/pthread_frame.c:671" [Undecided, Confirmed]
[16:29] <JanC> I mean boot into the bootloader, and then load from the other one
[16:32] <Guest42_> I was disconnected and didn't see any messages for the last five minutes
[16:41] <Guest42> there is an option in the program I'm using to image my flash drives, to use its own version of GRUB, not what's in the disk image. I wonder if that would get ubuntu's installer to boot...?
[16:42] <Guest42> I'm going to try that option with the linux mint installer, and see what happens
[16:43] <AngryTom> How can I enable animations for Mission Control on Ubuntu 23.10?
[16:44] <AngryTom> Cannot find it in settings and googled also.
[16:56] <Guest63> should I have a separate user for each service I want to host on my machine?
[17:01] <rbox> Guest63: most are already set up like that...
[17:01] <Guest63> rbox: i mean, should i do it for the server scripts i want to run too
[17:02] <Guest63> with adduser -r myscript
[17:03] <rbox> "the server scripts"?
[17:03] <Guest63> i have an irc bot running on the server
[17:03] <Guest63> is it good practice to run it as a separate user from my regular sudo account
[17:04] <rbox> if the bot gets hacked, the person would have access to your files and if they know your password root
[17:04] <rbox> would you be okay with that?
[17:04] <Guest63> NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[17:04] <rbox> well then i guess you just answered your own question
[17:06] <Guest42> is there a known way to get the ubuntu installer to run on machines which predate UEFI? if not, could anyone suggest another distribution I could use?
[17:06] <Guest42> machine is ~15 years old. x64
[17:08] <rbox> i'm not seeing anytihng that says they dropped bios support
[17:09] <Guest42> I can boot knoppix, but Mint and Ubuntu installers aren't seen as bootable when put on a flash drive
[17:09] <Guest42> I don't know for sure that uefi/bios is the cause
[17:09] <rbox> https://askubuntu.com/questions/1406886/does-ubuntu-22-04-require-a-uefi-instead-of-a-bios
[17:09] <Guest42> yeah, I read that one rbox
[17:09] <rbox> then do what it says
[17:09] <Guest42> I did
[17:10] <Guest42> doesn't help. doesn't work
[17:10] <Guest42> I did google this before coming here.
[17:12] <Guest42> it's been a long time since I used a computer this old. I'm not even familiar with this computer at all. I'm not sure why knoppix works and Mint and Ubuntu don't want to boot. I'm certain I'm doing everything the same, just using different disk image files for the different disributions
[17:12] <Guest42> it was easier for me to put linux on my macbook than this.
[17:12] <rbox> you can't be doing everythign the same... you ahve to follow those insturctions
[17:13] <Guest42> I followed them exactly. like I said, I found that page before
[17:14] <Guest42> do you have experience with this particular problem, and found those instructions worked?
[17:15] <Guest42> if not, it's a bit condescending to just tell someone to do what the first hit on google suggests and then assume they're not following instructions if they still have issues
[17:15] <Guest42> what worked for one person on stackoverflow won't necessarily work for others with similar issues
[17:15] <JanC> what error do you see when you try to boot the Ubuntu one?
[17:17] <Guest42> if I take away the machine's internal hard disk as a boot option, I get a standard message about no bootable media
[17:17] <JanC> some BIOS firmwares are picky/buggy about what disks they want to boot...
[17:17] <Guest42> I never even see GRUB or anything
[17:17] <lotuspsychje> witch tool did you burn your ubuntu usb Guest42
[17:17] <Guest42> yeah. I am thinking of trying a bios update
[17:17] <Guest42> manufacturer website is down right now though
[17:18] <Guest42> lotuspsychje: Rufus. I have to do this from windows.
[17:18] <JanC> e.g. some only want to boot ISO images (no matter if it's on a CD or flash), others don't want to boot ISO images from flash (but only FAT), etc.
[17:18] <Guest42> also tried unetbootin
[17:18] <Guest42> I am going to try ventoy as well
[17:18] <lotuspsychje> ventoy is great
[17:19] <Guest42> going to try it right now. brb while I try
[17:23] <Guest42> ventoy did not work. I think my only hope is updating the bios to the latest version
[17:23] <Guest42> or using knoppix
[17:24] <Guest42> i'm not sure what kind of black magic knoppix uses so that it works on this machine when others don't
[17:27] <lotuspsychje> Guest42: im not sure a biosupdate will fix a non booting ubuntu usb, i think theres another root cause
[17:28] <Guest42> I thought maybe the manufacturer would've tweaked something to support booting from different OSes. but Windows 10 installed and runs just fine, so maybe not.
[17:30] <Guest42> this machine is so ancient that it has a dvd burner, but if some Linux live media work and others don't, I'm skeptical that buying some blank DVDs wouldn't be a waste of money
[17:31] <Guest42> as a sanity check, I'm going to try knoppix again, and verify that it still works
[17:33] <oerheks> if knoppix does not boot too, it could be windows 10 + fastboot issue
[17:34] <Guest42> not sure: if I disable the internal hard disk in the firmware settings, I get told there's no bootable media
[17:35] <Guest42> and I got the boot menu with the internal hard disk listed as top priority, with the knoppix live medium inserted
[17:35] <Guest42> if I recall correctly
[17:36] <jeremy31> Is grub on the internal hard disk or is it Windows only?
[17:37] <Guest42> windows only. I haven't had a chance to run anything but the windows 10 installer, or knoppix live medium, so there's no way I could have even installed grub.
[17:38] <Guest42> the knoppix image is done writing to my flash drive. I'll try it now. be right back
[17:49] <Guest42> knoppix didn't work. I will try with fast startup disabled. thanks for suggesting that.
[17:49] <oerheks> :-)
[17:57] <Guest42> fastboot, or whatever it's called, was the issue! I think knoppix booting was a fluke, and windows had fully shut down because it was installing an update
[17:58] <Guest42> thank you thank you thank you for suggesting that this might be the issue.
[17:58] <lotuspsychje> !yay
[17:59] <oerheks> :-)
[18:01] <Guest42> I've made a sacrifice to Microsoft of hours of my weekend, now let us pray that the tech gods are appeased and allow me to install ubuntu
[18:10] <BlackNoir> Hi guys just want to ask if you guys also experiencing some snap application sudden not responding? I'm trying to run Lutris but most of the time it suddenly no responding i'm using ubuntu 23.10
[18:42] <tomreyn> BlackNoir: you could possibly get help with this in #lutris
[18:44] <ravage> do they build the snap?
[18:45] <ravage> the store link says to report to https://bugs.launchpad.net/lutris-snap
[18:45] <ravage> "The Snap Is In Testing Phase Currently"
[18:45] <tomreyn> https://launchpad.net/~capecrusader-121 is where Contact points to
[18:46] <tomreyn> i mean it's the snap developer
[18:46] <ravage> i only use the deb releases
[18:46] <tomreyn> i can't tell whether sameer is part of the lutris team
[18:46] <ravage> there used to be a repo but somehow that vansihed
[18:47] <tomreyn> i used to use that, too, but it was no longer maintained at some point
[19:19] <toddc> BlackNoir: lutris snap ver 0.5.9.1 did not even install on 22.04.3 Gnome
[19:40] <webchat52> hi
[19:41] <webchat52> anyone here who can help me on a steam snap error message?
[19:43] <webchat52> nobody? :(
[19:44] <EriC^^> !ask | webchat52
[19:46] <webchat52> !ask
[19:46] <webchat52> When I try to start Counter Strike 2 in steam, I get this error message: AppSystemDict: Error in Init () of interface "RenderDeviceMgr001"!
[19:47] <qfive> webchat52: have you tried anything so far?
[19:47] <webchat52> what to you mean with "anything"?
[19:47] <webchat52> *do
[19:48] <EriC^^> webchat52: try to Set launch options => -dx11
[19:49] <webchat52> tried it...does not work
[19:49] <qfive> still the same error after trying that?
[19:49] <webchat52> yes
[19:49] <webchat52> I didnt had this error a week ago or so...
[19:49] <webchat52> must be an update
[19:51] <webchat52> any other ideas how to fix this error?
[19:52] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: did you try the latest/candidate channel for the steam snap?
[19:53] <webchat52> how do I try that and is this stable/secure? I installed the snap on my Ubuntu 22.04.03 just through the software center
[19:54] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: open a terminal and run: snap refresh steam --channel=latest/candidate
[19:55] <webchat52> is the latest/candidate a beta or something like that? because Im not really interested in unstable betas...
[19:56] <CosmicDJ> that would be the edge channel
[19:59] <webchat52> can't install the latest version through steam by going to "Steam>Check for steam client updates" ?
[19:59] <webchat52> *I
[20:00] <ravage> not if you use the snap version
[20:02] <webchat52> but then at least it should be possible to get the latest steam version through the software center where I installed it?
[20:03] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: steam auto-updates, so you have the latest stable steam release; the snap is how steam is playing along with ubuntu
[20:03] <ravage> or you use the .deb that steam provides
[20:05] <webchat52> software center shows that I have steam version  1.0.0.78....so I already have the latest version
[20:05] <webchat52> must be something else then
[20:07] <CosmicDJ> maybe, I had some proton games which didn't launch anymore a few days ago, updating the steam snap to candidate fixed it
[20:07] <webchat52> I dont use Proton since counter strike 2 is native on linux
[20:09] <webchat52> btw this error message I get when using my nvidia graphic card....when I use my Intel iGPU I can start the game but only get like 4-8 fps and almost everything crashes....when I close steam...everything else runs fine again
[20:10] <webchat52> a week ago I had about 80-100 fps on my intel IGPU in counterstrike 2
[20:11] <webchat52> an update killed both graphic cards you could say
[20:12] <CosmicDJ> maybe a kernel update? boot the old and find out...
[20:14] <webchat52> first I dont know how to boot the old kernel and second....doesnt the new kernel has security fixes and stuff like that...so I would make my system vulnerable by booting an old kernel?
[20:22] <ahc> Just tried using  unetbootin  to create bootable USB with 22.04 Ubuntu Studio, didn't boot. USB is FAT formatted (I guess). Said "file does not fit into a 512-byte sector". I'll try with the native Create Start Disk next. Some say reformat the USB as ext4 or exFAT. Can anyone please comment?
[20:23] <ravage> The Ubuntu tool works
[20:24] <ravage> On other systems we usually get good results with etcher
[20:24] <webchat52> I good the best results always with etcher
[20:24] <webchat52> *I got
[20:25] <Maik> ahc Unetbootin isn't the recommended way to flash usb with anymore for a long time
[20:27] <ahc> OK. Should I reformat USB before trying again using etcher or Create Startup Disk? The Ubuntu Studio page says use unetbootin, so I may drop them a note.
[20:28] <Rockericy> Ventoy works very well for me
[20:29] <webchat52> although I'm no expert....you can reformat but I think at least etcher does the formatting already
[20:29] <qfive> Ventoy works very well in my experience too
[20:30] <ahc> webchat52 Thenks
[20:30] <Maik> so does Create Startup Disk webchat52 :)
[20:30] <Maik> ahc what are you using now as os?
[20:31] <webchat52> is there a IRC channel for snaps or the steam snap specifically?
[20:32] <ahc> Am on 20.04  here
[20:32] <Maik> ubuntu?
[20:33] <ahc> Yes. The USB is for a guy to try Studio on a Windows laptop.
[20:34] <Maik> you could also uses Disks and simply select Restore Disk Image
[20:34] <Maik> uses/use
[20:34] <ahc> OK. Leave it with me. Thanks folks. I'll try Create Startup Disk next. See how we go.
[20:37] <Rockericy> I have a question:
[20:37] <Rockericy> My Ubuntu don't want to update. Im currently on Ubuntu 22.04.3 LTS. I also get a message that there is new version on. But when i click on Update it just disappear. Have somone an idea what to do?
[20:37] <webchat52> Ubuntu doesnt seem really stable if a week or so ago I had no problems with starting counter strike 2 with my normal graphic card or my IGPU and now....only about a week later....nothing really works lol
[20:38] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: well it seems like you don´t want to do anything about it, so I guess you have to wait unless the problem disappears again
[20:38] <CosmicDJ> /unless/until/
[20:39] <Maik> probably more of a PEBCAK CosmicDJ
[20:39] <Maik> maybe his computer just isn't made for gaming on linux
[20:39] <webchat52> well what should I do? and of course I dont want to experiment on my system so in the end I got more problems later
[20:40] <CosmicDJ> switching a snap channel is no big deal, you can easily switch back... rebooting an older kernel will also not open pandoras box
[20:41] <Maik> stick with Windows for gaming and use ubuntu in dual boot i guess is the best option :)
[20:41] <CosmicDJ> if you still don´t want to, try your luck there -> https://forum.snapcraft.io/
[20:44] <webchat52> no hate, but suggesting to use windows for gaming in an ubuntu channel...seems kinda wrong lol
[20:45] <Maik> no it isn't, it's just good advice ;)
[20:45] <ravage> Install the steam Deb version to rule out a problem with snap
[20:45] <ravage> I never tried the snap version at all
[20:46] <WhereDItGo> Greetings! I've recently had a rather bizarre upgrade experience from 23.04 to 23.10. I freshly installed 23.04 & had just finished configuring the system Settings when it detected 23.10 available - I knew better than to click upgrade, until I didn't. I waited as it downloaded/removed "unnecessary"/whatever & reboot. Well, first thing I noticed (that was NOT mentioned might happen & indeed WAS a NEEDED package) was that the
[20:46] <WhereDItGo> system provided wallpaper in 23.04 I liked had gone to a solid black. tl;dr I figured out why & the fix. But then I realized that the Software Center (as touted to be one of the biggest upgrades)...didn't get upgraded. Not installed. Nada. The old Ubuntu Software Center is still here, complaining about an update to itself/the new Software Center. Where do I start to try & figure out what happened, why it happened, & what the
[20:46] <WhereDItGo> fix is?
[20:49] <Maik> WhereDItGo : snap refresh snap-store --channel=latest/stable/ubuntu-23.10
[20:50] <Maik> tell me if that works
[20:54] <WhereDItGo> Still here; didn't work, but starting to think it's because I have to kill a (rogue?) process. Ubuntu Software is closed, and I previously had issued the snap refresh command, completing with no errors
[20:55] <Maik> what did the output show?
[20:55] <WhereDItGo> ~$ snap refresh snap-store --channel=latest/stable/ubuntu-23.10
[20:55] <WhereDItGo> error: cannot refresh "snap-store": snap "snap-store" has running apps
[20:55] <WhereDItGo>        (ubuntu-software), pids: 2765
[20:56] <Maik> sudo kill -9 2765
[20:56] <Maik> and then run the previous command i gave
[20:59] <a13x57> hi!
[21:00] <WhereDItGo> Upon killing the process, a notification came in saying the Snap Store was sucessfully refreshed (didn't see this previously) & now the Ubuntu Software icon pinned to the bar at the bottom disappeared. On a hunch, looked for new icon in Application drawer; found "App Center". Seems to have launched successfully without needing to re-run the command you gave (either it was stuck because of that process & was waiting to
[21:00] <WhereDItGo> "switch", or when I ran it the first time, it put it in the first scenario state)
[21:01] <Maik> at least it's now updated
[21:02] <Maik> problem solved i guess :)
[21:03] <WhereDItGo> Thank you very much for your help Maik! Any idea how (log, something else) I could see /why/ this happened; /what/ caused this? A fresh install failing to "install" a major part of an upgrade seems like a huge issue. Figuring out how to connect (correctly) to IRC drained me enough; is this a bug? Is it a long process to [setup an account] & report this?
[21:05] <Maik> no problem, glad i could help. Why it's happening i don't know to be honest.
[21:07] <WhereDItGo> The wallpaper going black because the previous versions "wallpaper package" was uninstalled as "unnecessary"; is that I known thing from version to version?
[21:07] <WhereDItGo> *a known
[21:08] <webchat52> If I switch from stable to candidate release for the steam snap...do I lose any data like my games or my settings for steam?
[21:08] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: no you don't
[21:12] <Maik> WhereDItGo iirc it should change to the new default wallpaper of that ubuntu release
[21:14] <webchat52> So I tried the release candiate of the steam snap and counter strike 2 starts with no error message
[21:14] <webchat52> only kinda laggy
[21:15] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: are you sure it's using your nvidia GPU?
[21:15] <webchat52> in my nvidia setting I'm on "performance mode"
[21:17] <CosmicDJ> webchat52: install nvidia-utils-535 (if you're using the nvidia-535 driver) and run nvidia-smi in Terminal, it should show which apps are running on your nvidia gpu
[21:18] <webchat52> I got a old nvidia card....the highest version is the nvidia-driver-470
[21:21] <webchat52> problem with nvidia is one thing...but a week ago I had 80-100 fps with my Intel processor graphic card....and with the stable release now only 4-8 fps and everything freezes and crashes...my Intel processor is from 2021
[21:23] <CosmicDJ> are you sure it's using your intel gpu? install intel-gpu-tools and run intel_gpu_top as root in Terminal to find out
[21:23] <furkan> Hi all, ever since updating to Ubuntu 23.10, when I launch TexWorks I get the gear icon that shows up instead of the TexWorks icons. I tried reinstalling TexWorks and the Yaru theme packages with apt install --reinstall. Does anybody have any suggestions?
[21:24] <webchat52> If I chose "nvidia on demand" and not "Performance mode" in my nvidia settings then its always on the intel processor graphics
[21:25] <webchat52> but I need to do restart now an try intel card with the release candidate of the steam snap
[21:25] <webchat52> will be back in minutes
[21:30] <webchat52> I am back
[21:30] <webchat52> my intel processor graphics card now also work better
[21:31] <webchat52> but also a little bit laggy
[21:31] <webchat52> not as much as on my nvidia graphic card though
[21:32] <webchat52> somehow the steam snap stable release ruins everything for me
[21:32] <webchat52> candidate release for the steam snap at least somehow works
[21:33] <ravage> webchat52: https://cdn.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/client/installer/steam.deb
[21:33] <ravage> try the non-snap version and see if that solves things
[21:33] <ravage> if that works better use the snap forum to report your bugs
[21:33] <ravage> there is not much we can do here really
[21:37] <webchat52> again...a week or so ago everything was fine....then something broke both, my normal graphic card and my intel processor graphic card.....so Ubuntu doesnt seem that stable
[21:37] <ravage> feel free to try other distributions
[21:37] <webchat52> and I actually want the snap version because of the (allegedly) secure design
[21:37] <ravage> blaming ubuntu for not running closed source software perfectly is still strange
[21:38] <webchat52> true, but the steam snap is made by canonical right?
[21:38] <ravage> i guess someone packages it yes
[21:38] <JanC> Canonical or Valve, dunno
[21:39] <ravage> but canonical is not the Ubuntu community. and this is a community help channel
[21:39] <ravage> not canonical support
[21:39] <JanC> you can always try to create your own container to run a non-Snap Steam
[21:39] <JanC> (if you care about security)
[21:40] <oerheks> steam and intel, .. must be the latest gen
[21:41] <webchat52> processor is from 2021 so not the newest
[21:41] <JanC> not all games on Steam are high-end
[21:42] <oerheks> maybe !hwe is the solution, only if you are on LTS
[21:42] <oerheks> !hwe
[21:43] <ravage> it is 23.10
[21:44] <ravage> oh sorry
[21:44] <ravage> mixed users up. i guess it is 22.04
[21:44] <ravage> no idea about the kernel version
[21:45] <webchat52> strange, I just switched again to the stable release and everything works and does not crash like before
[21:45] <JanC> heh
[21:50] <webchat52> really strange....maybe I need a new/fresher install of the steam snap to fix my problems
[21:50] <webchat52> *needed
[21:51] <webchat52> will be back in minutes...will try a restart of my computer and see
[21:54] <webchat52> I am back
[21:56] <webchat52> I dont know what the problem was, but switching from steam snap stable release to steam snap candidate solved all the problems....the problems all are gone even now although I switched back to the stable release of the steam snap
[21:57] <webchat52> *solved all the previous problems, but was now laggy with canditate release...now switching back to steam stable release really solved every problem
[22:00] <webchat52> btw do you use x11 or wayland?
[22:05] <webchat52> oh and of course thanks to maik and the other guy for the help
[22:10] <WhereDItGo> webchat52 If you 'Logout', when you select the desired account from the Login screen, before inputting the password there will be a cogwheel in the lower right corner - you can toggle it there =)
[22:31] <Icecream> hi, does anyone know how to find out if my nvidia card gets any driver updates in the future? I heard of driver version 525 for nvidia, but mine goes only up to version 470
[22:31] <rbox> sounds like a question for nvidia
[22:32] <ravage> but the realistic answer here is n
[22:32] <ravage> no
[22:32] <Icecream> well yes and no....I want to know if maybe the open source driver is newer than my nvidia proprietary driver
[22:33] <ravage> https://nouveau.freedesktop.org/CodeNames.html
[22:33] <toddc> !nvidia | Icecream
[22:33] <ravage> https://nouveau.freedesktop.org/FeatureMatrix.html
[22:34] <ravage> so check the matrix. try nouveau if it looks like it could work
[22:35] <Icecream> nouveau got no news updates since january 2021....is the project dead?
[22:37] <ravage> no idea. never used it
[22:39] <ravage> as a general rule i would use the driver provided by nvidia if there is one
[22:40] <rbox> Icecream: what problem are you having?
[22:41] <Icecream> the reason I ask is, that I read recently somewhere that there is a nvidia vulnerability and you should update your driver to 525 in linux....my driver version only goes up to 470
[22:42] <toddc> waiting on nvidia?
[22:42] <Icecream> well what else can I do?
[22:42] <ravage> nothing
[22:42] <Icecream> if you give me couple of hundred dollars I will buy amd
[22:43] <ravage> nope
[22:43] <toddc> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-525
[22:43] <Icecream> so I thought if nvidia doesnt delivers than mybe nouevou
[22:43] <toddc> still in testing
[22:44] <rbox> Icecream: okay, so disable the nvidia driver
[22:44] <Icecream> yeah but now I saw that the nouevou project seems dead
[22:45] <Icecream> no news from them since 2021 january
[22:45] <rbox> it doesnt need to have news
[22:45] <rbox> "still working"
[22:45] <rbox> do you want them t o post that every month?
[22:46] <Icecream> well every 2 years at least
[22:46] <Icecream> its now almost 3 years
[22:46] <ravage> that is all nice but OT here
[22:46] <ravage> your choices are the provided driver by nvidia or try nouveau
[22:47] <ravage> there is really nothing in between
[22:47] <Icecream> thing is I only want the new driver for security reasons and how do I know if nouveau fixed everything?
[22:47] <rbox> Icecream: do you want every driver in the kernel to post updates every month saying "still working"?
[22:48] <rbox> Icecream: its part of the kernel, if there is an unfixed vulernatiblity, it will be removed
[22:48] <rbox> Icecream: a bug in the nvidia crap has nothing to do with bugs in the kernel
[22:48] <Icecream> oh really? I didnt know that
[22:49] <ravage> they share 0 lines of code
[22:50] <rbox> well im sure they both have some lines that are the same
[22:50] <rbox> like #include <randomkernelinclude.h>
[22:50] <Icecream> so everything what is in the kernel has to fix every vulnerability?
[22:50] <Icecream> or linus torvalds kicks them out?
[22:51] <rbox> every  bug in the kernel is fixed
[22:51] <ravage> you have to find it first and there needs to be a bug report
[22:51] <gry> I assume if someone is maintaining a kernel module for, for example, intel wifi, and it has many vulnerabilities, then it's impractical to keep it, yes
[22:51] <gry> whether to kick out or to have some procedure to get someone else to take over the maintaining - no idea
[22:51] <gry> there was ##kerneldev channel for that before
[22:52] <Icecream> any website out there I can read something about that?
[22:52] <rbox> about what
[22:52] <gry> now all i can see is #ubuntu-kernel and #kernelnewbies :-)
[22:52] <gry> their channel topics may have relevant reading links
[22:52] <Icecream> that everything in the kernel has always to fix vulnerabilities if any found
[22:53] <gry> right, please click here >>>> #ubuntu-kernel <<<< and click here >>>> #kernelnewbies <<<
[22:53] <ravage> also there is no "law" that forces anyone to fix anything. bad code may be removed
[22:54] <ravage> that happened a few times in the past
[22:57] <Icecream> thx for the info
[23:02] <Icecream16> since nouveau is part of the kernel....can anyone tell me how to look up the latest change of nouveau in the kernel?
[23:03] <rbox> Icecream16: download the source code and look at the git log
[23:04] <Icecream16> maybe a little more explaining for newbies and possibly idiots?
[23:05] <Icecream16> I mean I only want to look up the latest change of nouveau and not look through every kernel news
[23:05] <ravage> https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/nouveau/
[23:11] <Icecream16> thx, according to their archives this project is still alive
[23:11] <Icecream16> still strange that no news from them since january 2021
[23:11] <rbox> lol
[23:12] <Icecream16> not everyone has time to dive into all this stuff : D
[23:12] <rbox> most people dont care...
[23:12] <Icecream16> even of those that care....most of them dont have the time
[23:12] <oerheks> it just works..
[23:13] <rbox> can't say i've ever worried about the last time any random kernel driver was updated
[23:14] <Icecream16> thing is if I go for the nouveau driver, how can I choose my processor graphics?
[23:14] <rbox> what do you mean "choose"
[23:14] <Icecream16> my nvidia card is acutally just a backup for my intel processor graphics
[23:15] <Icecream16> I want to use the intel card
[23:15] <Icecream16> well not really a card
[23:15] <rbox> that depends on your hardware, and how its configured at the hardware level
[23:16] <Icecream16> I even game on my intel processor graphics..so how can I choose that it stays this way after choosing nouveau
[23:16] <rbox> what do you mean "choosing nouveau"
[23:16] <JanC> do you actually want to use the Nvidia?
[23:16] <Icecream16> well now I chose the proprietary nvidia driver and not nouveau
[23:16] <rbox> you installed the proprietary driver
[23:17] <rbox> you dint "choose" anything
[23:17] <Icecream16> well in ubuntu its just clicking....
[23:17] <leftyfb> then why bother with nouveau?
[23:17] <Icecream16> because its more secure I guess
[23:17] <rbox> huh?
[23:17] <leftyfb> in what way?
[23:17] <leftyfb> it's a graphics driver
[23:17] <JanC> rbox: I think there is an option in the installer & Software store where you can choose with checkboxes
[23:18] <rbox> you can enable propreitary drivers
[23:18] <Icecream16> I already have
[23:18] <Icecream16> but I want nouveau and still have my intel processor graphics running as the first
[23:18] <Icecream16> as main
[23:18] <leftyfb> why?
[23:18] <oerheks> for what card?"
[23:18] <JanC> is this a desktop or laptop?
[23:18] <Icecream16> its an old one
[23:19] <Icecream16> desktop
[23:19] <oerheks> 9200 ?
[23:19] <Icecream16> nah 660
[23:19] <Icecream16> : )
[23:19] <oerheks> that one used to be supported with 340, now nouveau
[23:19] <oerheks> ??
[23:20] <Icecream16> but the newest drive is 525 or something with all the security fixes
[23:20] <Icecream16> *driver
[23:20] <leftyfb> Icecream16: your system is working exactly the way you want but you prefer to change it and use the drivers with less features and less updates which does not give you the one main function you're looking for because .... ?
[23:21] <oerheks> 525 starts with 750i ?
[23:22] <Icecream16> I dont think you get what I mean....the nvidia card is only for backup and maybe browsing, so the focus is more on stability and security and not performance for gaming....on the other hand is my inter processor graphics for gaming and what I want to use daily
[23:22] <Icecream16> *intel
[23:23] <JanC> that Nvidia has a separate monitor attached?
[23:23] <Icecream16> no, why?
[23:23] <leftyfb> Icecream16: what makes you think the drivers made by reverse-engineering the proprietary drivers, with less features and hasn't been updated in 2 years is going to be more stable and secure?
[23:24] <Icecream16> someone said that nouveau is part of the kernel and gets security updates
[23:25] <leftyfb> Icecream16: it's not more "secure"
[23:25] <leftyfb> nor is it more stable
[23:25] <Icecream16> why exactly?
[23:25] <leftyfb> why what?
[23:26] <Icecream16> why not more secure?
[23:26] <leftyfb> Icecream16: you're asking me to prove a negative?
[23:26] <oerheks> be happy with nouveau and 30 fps youtube
[23:26] <Icecream16> well I thought that the kernel gets regularily updates and nvidia is just....well nividia
[23:27] <leftyfb> Icecream16: you're going though a lot of effort based on false assumptions for no benefit
[23:27] <leftyfb> don't fix wasn't isn't broke
[23:27] <oerheks> legacy cards are covered with nouveau, pretty good
[23:27] <oerheks> and newest also with open drivers
[23:27] <Icecream16> see what oerheks said
[23:28] <leftyfb> he's naming features. Not benefits over the proprietary drivers
[23:28] <leftyfb> you're works fine at the moment
[23:28] <oerheks> 660 is legacy, AFAIK
[23:28] <Icecream16> it works yes, but does it get security updates from nvidia?
[23:29] <oerheks> no updates from nouveau, if any
[23:29] <leftyfb> Icecream16: yes
[23:29] <leftyfb> but also, it's a graphics driver
[23:29] <leftyfb> there's not really security issues with graphics drivers
[23:30] <Icecream16> where can I get the news, that it still gets security updates?
[23:30] <Icecream16> havent read it anywhere
[23:31] <oerheks> https://www.kernel.org/category/site-news.html
[23:31] <oerheks> add yourself to the mailing lists?
[23:31] <leftyfb> Icecream16: apt changelog nvidia-driver-XXX
[23:32] <Icecream16> here from nvidia driver release: "NVIDIA has released a software security update for NVIDIA GPU Display Driver. This update addresses issues that may lead to code execution, denial of service, escalation of privileges, information disclosure, and data tampering."
[23:32] <Icecream16> "only graphic drivers" huh?
[23:33] <Slartibart> Hi. When I login to my kubuntu now I get a message that it's time to upgrade to 23.10. However, when I click on it to start the updater I instead get a window with 'Upgrade failed with the following output'(translated), but the output area is empty! Can I somehow run software updater and get some output?
[23:33] <leftyfb> Slartibart: there is not supported upgrade path to 23.10 released yet
[23:34] <Slartibart> w00t? But why do I get a message about it then?
[23:34] <leftyfb> oh, heh. Maybe it did just get released :)
[23:35] <leftyfb> sorry, I only run LTS's
[23:35] <Slartibart> Gah!
[23:35] <oerheks> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/announcement-ubuntu-desktop-23-10-release-image-translation-incident-now-resolved/39365
[23:35] <Slartibart> That was scary.
[23:35] <leftyfb> oerheks: not the same thing. That was for the iso's
[23:36] <oerheks> just wait, do not use -d
[23:37] <Icecream16> so nobody really knows here if nouveau or the nividia driver is more secure?
[23:37] <oerheks> more secure, no, no info on that.
[23:37] <JanC> Icecream16: you can try fuzzing both & see which one crashes more often  :)
[23:37] <oerheks> nouveau got pretty good lately
[23:38] <leftyfb> Icecream16: it's not really a concern
[23:38] <Icecream16> JanC secure in secure against hacking
[23:38] <oerheks> i bet there is no nvia for 660?
[23:38] <leftyfb> nobody is "hacking" your video driver
[23:38] <oerheks> c/nvidia
[23:39] <Icecream16> leftyfb why then from nvidia driver release: "NVIDIA has released a software security update for NVIDIA GPU Display Driver. This update addresses issues that may lead to code execution, denial of service, escalation of privileges, information disclosure, and data tampering."
[23:39] <oerheks> it does not say what driver.
[23:39] <leftyfb> Icecream16: https://ubuntu.com/security/cves
[23:40] <leftyfb> Icecream16: feel free to go through every open CVE for ubuntu and remove every package with an open cve. I guarantee your system will no longer run
[23:41] <leftyfb> Icecream16: there's a term: pick your battles
[23:41] <Icecream16> one of those two, nvidia driver or nouveau, has to be more secure than the other....I didnt say perfect security
[23:43] <acu> is there good GUI app installer that is available both for Ubuntu and Debian (except sysnaptic-package-manager) ?
[23:43] <xangua> Gnome install? Whatever is called
[23:43] <JanC> what do you mean by "good"?
[23:43] <Icecream16> leftyfb apparently you just dont know, which is fine, but then just say so
[23:43] <xangua> KDE install, the same
[23:44] <leftyfb> Icecream16: no, I don't know. And most people aren't going to. Because it doesn't really matter
[23:44] <JanC> there is Gnome Software, Apper, PackageKit Gnome, and probably a couple others
[23:44] <oerheks> good luck finding out, no worries about legacy 660 and nouveau
[23:45] <acu> OK - I am trying to see how to install Gnome Software --- what is the app I neet to do apt install gnome-software ?
[23:45] <oerheks> cryptominers avoid those, i guess
[23:45] <Icecream16> leftyfb only people that can say that it doesnt matter are experts that definetely know the answer I am searching for....and you are not of them, which like I said is fine with me
[23:46] <Icecream16> *not one of them
[23:51] <acu> I need to install educationa apps for a 12 year old - mathematics etc... and want to use some gui that explains about app
[23:52] <ravage> acu: open Ubuntu Software. click "Education"
[23:52] <oerheks> only if the app is supported in our repos
[23:52] <ravage> everything else is not supported here anyway
[23:53] <acu> I wonder if the ubuntu-software can be installed in Debian12 ?
[23:53] <leftyfb> acu: not supported here
[23:53] <oerheks> gnome-software perhaps?
[23:53] <acu> what is the name of the ubuntu software appe
[23:53] <oerheks> in # debian
[23:53] <acu> OK
[23:54] <oerheks> synaptic would be your best choice