/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2023/11/21/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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* cpaelzer lights the campfire for the MIR meeting15:29
dviererbeo/15:29
cpaelzertravellers of the world back from sprints, let us ssee how much has piled up15:29
cpaelzer#startmeeting Weekly Main Inclusion Requests status15:30
meetingologyMeeting started at 15:30:00 UTC.  The chair is cpaelzer.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology15:30
meetingologyAvailable commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick15:30
cpaelzerPing for MIR meeting - didrocks joalif slyon sarnold cpaelzer jamespage ( eslerm dviererbe )15:30
cpaelzerI'm early, you ahve time15:30
jamespageo/15:30
cpaelzerbut I wanted to get the ping out early :-)15:30
cpaelzerih dviererbe, hi jamespage15:30
slyono/15:30
cpaelzernew release, new auto-sync surely lots of new $%&/(15:30
cpaelzerso let us get started15:30
cpaelzer#topic current component mismatches15:30
cpaelzerMission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams15:30
cpaelzer#link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.svg15:30
cpaelzer#link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg15:30
cpaelzerthe non proposed shows postgresql-1615:31
cpaelzerthat is a transition being worked on by athos15:31
cpaelzerbut a bit later in the cycle15:31
cpaelzerso we will see it a few more times15:31
cpaelzerAnyway, this won#t be a new MIR as it is just source rename15:31
cpaelzerso once athos asks, we can promote it under the condition it did not dramatically change15:32
cpaelzerin -proposed we have15:32
mirespaceo/15:32
slyonlibio-prompter-perl is assigned to a collegue in Foundations.15:32
cpaelzera bunch of libmail-dkim-perl which is from mirespace that just logged in15:32
slyonI uploaded python-keyring earlier today, to downgrade Recommends->Suggests, so that should be resolved, soon.15:32
cpaelzerand thanks slyon for knowing that the prompter-perl is already been worked on in your team15:32
cpaelzerdouble thanks for that slyon15:32
cpaelzerI see llvm-toolchain-17 at the end of the postgresql tree15:33
sarnoldgood morning15:33
cpaelzerslyon: that is usually also all going to main as doko updates toolchains15:33
cpaelzerdo you happen to know more about it?15:33
cpaelzerand finally, not new but since jamespage said hi - jaraco.text and dependencies - how will this continue?15:34
slyoncpaelzer: I saw a question about llvm-toolchain-17 being in universe recently... But I think there wasn't an answer yet from the toolchains squad.15:34
jamespagelet me page that back in...15:34
cpaelzerslyon: I think we pick up the llvm set as default, hence it should be in main15:36
jamespagepydantic as some required TODO's - I'll get those sorted out15:36
cpaelzerslyon: this isn't urgent, maybe by next week you have an info what the way forward for noble shall be there15:36
cpaelzerso we can pass athos to use that or another llvm15:36
cpaelzerthanks jamespage15:36
cpaelzerthat feels like there is progress everywhere15:36
cpaelzermirespace: did you want to speak about libmail-dkim-perl ?15:36
slyonACK15:36
mirespaceno progress on that yet, sorry15:37
cpaelzerok, but AFAIR all we reviewed so far were ok with a few small required todo's15:37
cpaelzerone question on "is this a dup" which has been answered15:37
mirespace_checking..._15:38
cpaelzerand you mentioned that you'll cut the longer dependency tree to a short one15:38
cpaelzerfeel free to bring that up not or in the final AoB section15:38
cpaelzerI'm going on with the agenda for now15:38
cpaelzer#topic New MIRs15:38
mirespacebut that's for libmail-dmarc-perl, not for dkim-perl15:38
cpaelzerMission: ensure to assign all incoming reviews for fast processing15:38
cpaelzer#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&assignee_option=none&field.assignee=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir15:38
cpaelzerI see15:38
cpaelzerwhich is just what we see in the new queue right now15:38
sarnoldhehe15:38
mirespaceyes15:38
cpaelzerhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libemail-abstract-perl/+bug/203740515:38
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2037405 in libemail-abstract-perl (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libemail-abstract-perl (libemail-sender-perl dependency as libmail-dmarc-perl dependency)" [Undecided, New]15:39
cpaelzerhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libemail-sender-perl/+bug/203738915:39
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2037389 in libemail-sender-perl (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libemail-sender-perl (libmail-dmarc-perl dependency)" [Undecided, New]15:39
cpaelzerhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libthrowable-perl/+bug/203739215:39
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2037392 in libthrowable-perl (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libthrowable-perl (libemail-sender-perl dependency as libmail-dmarc-perl dependency)" [Undecided, New]15:39
cpaelzerall three look for a reviewer15:39
mirespacethat's three can be on hold15:39
cpaelzeror mirespace are you telling me this will be even less?15:39
cpaelzeron hold because we should be waiting for that dependency changes you mentioned?15:39
mirespaceall the 11 dependencies that I narrowed for dmarc are already reviewed, except the ppal libmail-dmarc-perl itself15:39
mirespaceyes15:40
cpaelzerok15:40
cpaelzerI'll mark them incomplete for now based on that15:40
cpaelzerthat removes them from the list until you'd change that15:40
mirespaceI could verigy with the test on both packages (dmarc-perl and spamassasin) that we can go with 11 packages for MIR, and move the rest to suggeted15:40
mirespacethatnkyou15:40
cpaelzerwe all appreciate the effort to not give us another 40 packages to review15:41
mirespace:)15:41
sarnoldyes :)15:41
slyonvery much so!15:41
cpaelzerthe one on  libmail-dmarc-perl is ongoing - right?15:41
cpaelzerhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libmail-dmarc-perl/+bug/202397115:41
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2023971 in libmail-dmarc-perl (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libmail-dmarc-perl" [High, Incomplete]15:41
cpaelzerincomplete and waiting for you15:41
mirespaceyes, I have a draft for the template and working on a dep8 package to include the mnaual verification for the functionality with the 11 packages15:42
cpaelzeronce you think this one is ready for us unassign yourself and set it back to NEW please15:42
cpaelzerthat sounds good mirespace15:42
cpaelzerif ever unsure just come by here again15:42
mirespaceok, thanks15:42
mirespaceI'll do15:42
cpaelzerthis is the easiest way to coordinate on this15:42
cpaelzerok, new bugs handled by all of that15:42
cpaelzer#topic Incomplete bugs / questions15:42
cpaelzerMission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams15:42
cpaelzer#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir15:42
dviererbesorry can I throw in dotnet6?15:42
cpaelzerwhich is exactly here15:43
cpaelzerin the incomplete list dviererbe15:43
cpaelzerthe others have been mirespace stack of packages15:43
dviererbeYes15:43
cpaelzerI've seen some dotnet updates out of the riga discussions15:43
cpaelzerfor all of you https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dotnet6/+bug/2023531/comments/1315:43
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2023531 in dotnet6 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] dotnet6" [Undecided, Incomplete]15:43
cpaelzerTL;DR no more so special/weird, and therefore fitting more nicely into existing patterns15:44
dviererbecorrect15:44
cpaelzerdviererbe: do you happen to know what is left open?15:44
cpaelzerand once they are supposed to be done, what steps are then the next?15:44
dviererbeAs far as I am aware we only had left recommends15:44
dviererbeOne strong recommends was smoke test during build time15:45
cpaelzerI remember15:45
cpaelzerhttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dotnet6/+bug/2023531/comments/4 has the full initial list15:45
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2023531 in dotnet6 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] dotnet6" [Undecided, Incomplete]15:45
cpaelzerdviererbe: so without that special behavior - is your SRU exception now approved. Or are you saying you do not even need one at all anymore?15:46
dviererbeThis is part of why I am here. We do not request an exception anymore.15:47
dviererbeTherefore I wanted to ask if you still want an formal ack by the SRU team?15:47
cpaelzerso you will process these under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Other_safe_cases - third bullet I guess15:48
cpaelzerand not an exception15:48
cpaelzerand no more "remove support later" as we ahve read15:49
dviererbeYes15:49
dviererbeThe support of dotnet packages should now behave as any other package15:49
cpaelzerI think we no more need a formal exception acked, but as a final confirmation I'd like to have one of the SRU members state on the MIR bug that this isn't a way to bypass the rules :-)15:49
cpaelzerdoes that make sense15:49
cpaelzerI know that everyone agreed in Riga, but the audit trail available to others lacks that15:50
cpaelzerunless we blindly believe your updates :-)15:50
dviererbeThat is fine :)15:50
cpaelzerafter that I think we are good15:50
cpaelzerI'll keep it open to recheck all TODO's tomorrow15:50
cpaelzerto ensure we haven't missed one15:50
cpaelzeronce myself and an SRU member are good15:50
cpaelzerwe can start promoting it15:50
dviererbesounds good15:51
cpaelzerand you might want to extend this to dotnetX as the same is true for all those versions right15:51
cpaelzerok, let us go from here and continue with the agenda ...15:51
dviererbecorrect. the only exception is dotnet7 in jammy (mentioned in the bug comment)15:51
cpaelzerack15:51
cpaelzer#topic Process/Documentation improvements15:52
cpaelzerMission: Review pending process/documentation pull-requests or issues15:52
cpaelzer#link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pulls15:52
cpaelzer#link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues15:52
cpaelzernothing new15:52
cpaelzerthe suggestion on defining clear deadlines has come up at the sprint15:52
cpaelzerI think everyone was fine, we are waiting for an PR by eslerm or sarnold for that I guess?15:53
cpaelzerobjections?15:53
slyonI pushed the "base-sets" story a bit at the Riga sprint. Verdict: We're back to status quo. The toolchains squad won't have resources to maintain important dependencies of those ecosystems in the foreseable future.15:53
cpaelzerhttps://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pull/41 might be that PR ...15:53
-ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Pull 41 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "security: add timeline, contact, and priority info" [Open]15:53
cpaelzerthanks slyon15:54
cpaelzerdo not give up on it though15:54
sarnoldI can't recall what specific date we actually converged on, heh15:54
cpaelzersarnold: eslerm: spelling issues left (or updates to the spelling DB)15:54
cpaelzerthe PR has it all15:54
cpaelzerit LGTM except the spelling fixes that are needed15:54
cpaelzerif you can get that updated before next week we can merge it there15:54
slyonsame here. +1 on the deadlines PR15:54
cpaelzer#topic MIR related Security Review Queue15:55
cpaelzerMission: Check on progress, do deadlines seem doable?15:55
cpaelzerSome clients can only work with one, some with the other escaping - the URLs point to the same place.15:55
cpaelzer#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=%5BMIR%5D&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir15:55
cpaelzer#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=[MIR]&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir15:55
cpaelzerInternal link15:55
cpaelzer- ensure your teams items are prioritized among each other as you'd expect15:55
cpaelzer- ensure community requests do not get stomped by teams calling for favors too much15:55
cpaelzer#link https://warthogs.atlassian.net/jira/software/c/projects/SEC/boards/59415:55
cpaelzerwe see all of them go through the queues one by one15:56
cpaelzer3 plus the one expected perl packages left open then15:56
cpaelzernothing else incoming yet15:56
sarnoldthis is the best this board has looked in ages :D nice15:56
sarnoldalas I've been busy elsewhere, and eslerm is out recently, so our status is pretty stale :(15:57
cpaelzerfair for now15:57
cpaelzer#topic Any other business?15:57
cpaelzernothing extra by me15:57
sarnoldI'll ask around to see if anyone can pick up things, but it's a challenging time of year, heh15:57
sarnoldnothing here15:57
cpaelzersarnold: it will be more challenging in 4 weeks15:57
slyonwrt the LLVM situation: according to the Noble schedule, we're targetting LLVM18 to become the default: https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/noble-numbat-release-schedule/3564915:57
slyonnothing else from me15:57
cpaelzersarnold:  and it not done before that then it is suddenly close to feature freeze15:57
cpaelzerslyon: fine, but we might need 17 in main until 18 exists for dependencies to move15:58
cpaelzertime is up15:58
cpaelzerthank you all15:58
cpaelzerthis was great and lots of things moved forward a little bit15:58
cpaelzero/15:58
slyono/15:58
cpaelzerlast chance15:58
cpaelzer415:58
cpaelzer315:58
cpaelzer215:58
slyonthanks cpaelzer, all!15:58
cpaelzer115:58
cpaelzer#endmeeting15:58
meetingologyMeeting ended at 15:58:45 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2023/ubuntu-meeting.2023-11-21-15.30.moin.txt15:58
dviererbeThanks! o/15:59
sarnoldthanks cpaelzer, all :)16:01
cpaelzersarnold: thanks for silencing the non-alphanumeric warnings16:55
cpaelzersarnold: but wasn't the issue that blocked you this16:55
cpaelzerError: README.md:1110:174 ... 184, Error - `Mattermost` is not a recognized word. (unrecognized-spelling)16:55
cpaelzer#42 is merged, that was fine16:56
cpaelzerbut it did not fix it to know about "Mattermost" AFAICS16:56
amurrayo/20:00
seb128hey!20:01
seb128amurray, you are today's chair according to the wiki20:01
amurrayah yes indeed20:01
seb128Steve and Robie declined the calendar invite20:02
amurrayis sil2100 around or is it just the two of us?20:02
seb128unsure if Lukasz is around20:02
seb128let me ping him on mattermost in case he's there20:03
seb128sil2100, hey20:04
sil2100hey20:04
amurray#startmeeting Ubuntu Technical Board20:04
meetingologyMeeting started at 20:04:58 UTC.  The chair is amurray.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology20:04
seb128sorry for distracting you from the things you focus on20:04
meetingologyAvailable commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick20:05
amurrayhey sil210020:05
amurray#topic Apologies20:05
amurrayrobie and steve both sent their apologies via the mailing list20:05
amurray#topic Action review20:05
amurrayACTION: seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage20:06
seb128I saw you commented there and Robie discussed it with Ken in Riga20:06
seb128but I think we need to carry over still20:06
amurrayyep ok no worries20:06
seb128I will try to reply to your comment this week though20:07
amurraythanks20:07
amurray#action seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage20:07
meetingologyACTION: seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage20:07
amurrayACTION: rbasak to draft a proposal of the DMB-proposed inactivity expiration policy for TB ratification20:07
amurrayI'll carry over robie's tasks20:07
amurray#action rbasak to draft a proposal of the DMB-proposed inactivity expiration policy for TB ratification20:07
meetingologyACTION: rbasak to draft a proposal of the DMB-proposed inactivity expiration policy for TB ratification20:07
amurrayACTION: rbasak to follow up on finding consensus on question of test plans for third party apps20:08
amurray#action rbasak to follow up on finding consensus on question of test plans for third party apps20:08
meetingologyACTION: rbasak to follow up on finding consensus on question of test plans for third party apps20:08
amurrayACTION: rbasak to open wider discussion on third-party repo policy20:08
amurray#action rbasak to open wider discussion on third-party repo policy20:08
meetingologyACTION: rbasak to open wider discussion on third-party repo policy20:08
amurrayACTION: seb128 to continue working with SRU, AA, Release, Backporters and Security teams to document their membership process and link to it from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard#Team_Delegations20:08
seb128carry over please20:08
amurrayfwiw security team is almost done on this from our side - thanks for kicking this off seb12820:09
amurray#action seb128 to continue working with SRU, AA, Release, Backporters and Security teams to document their membership process and link to it from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard#Team_Delegations20:09
meetingologyACTION: seb128 to continue working with SRU, AA, Release, Backporters and Security teams to document their membership process and link to it from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard#Team_Delegations20:09
seb128ah, nice, and you're welcome!20:09
amurrayACTION: vorlon to write up draft guidelines for packages in the archive that download from the Internet20:09
amurraywill carry over20:09
amurray#action vorlon to write up draft guidelines for packages in the archive that download from the Internet20:09
meetingologyACTION: vorlon to write up draft guidelines for packages in the archive that download from the Internet20:09
amurray#topic Scan the mailing list archive for anything we missed (standing item)20:09
amurray#link https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2023-November/thread.html20:10
amurrayso we have flavor requests for 24.0420:10
amurrayexcuse my ignorance but do we just usually vote on these here?20:11
seb128right, it just took me a bit to find the reference to what we need to do there since I'm new to it20:11
seb128it's documented on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RecognizedFlavors20:11
seb128'Guidelines for Tech Board to designate flavor image as LTS'20:11
seb128reading the guidelines I do feel like there is some investigation work to be done to answer the questions for each flavors20:12
seb128I'm not familiar enough with the work happening on those flavors to be able to vote now I think20:12
seb128amurray, sil2100, how do you feel about it?20:13
seb128I'm happy to spend some time on that this week though and follow up on the list with a summary of my 'investigation' for each though if that helps others20:14
amurrayso from our side we at least have to do the "Written confirmation from IS" part20:14
sil2100I'm fine with more flavors, should we maybe assign one flavor per one TB member to perform the investigation?20:14
sil2100To spread the workload20:14
seb128I would not say no to share if others have some time to work on that20:15
amurrayas far as the flavors themselves go, I am also not very familiar with any of them so I would  also be keen to ask a few more questions - particularly around the level of support offered and how big their teams are to handle it plus how many packages they are looking to support20:15
amurrayI'm also happy to take a flavor or two20:17
seb128same20:17
amurray#action seb128 to follow-up with ubuntu cinnamon on 24.04 request20:18
meetingologyACTION: seb128 to follow-up with ubuntu cinnamon on 24.04 request20:18
amurray#action sil2100 to follow-up with ubuntu studio on 24.04 request20:18
meetingologyACTION: sil2100 to follow-up with ubuntu studio on 24.04 request20:18
amurray#action amurray to follow-up with edubuntu on 24.04 request20:18
meetingologyACTION: amurray to follow-up with edubuntu on 24.04 request20:18
amurraygiven robie and steve are out, are we happy to assign one to each of them as well in their absentia?20:19
amurrayotherwise I can take another if one of you two are happy to also take a second?20:19
seb128I would rather not assign things to them without asking first, especially that Robie already said he would miss the next meeting20:19
seb128give me a second one20:20
amurrayok thanks seb12820:20
seb128I can always try to trade it with Robie or Steve if needed20:20
amurray#action seb128 to follow-up with ubuntu budgie on 24.04 request20:20
meetingologyACTION: seb128 to follow-up with ubuntu budgie on 24.04 request20:20
amurray#action amurray to follow-up with ubuntu kylin on 24.04 request20:20
meetingologyACTION: amurray to follow-up with ubuntu kylin on 24.04 request20:20
seb128but at least we have an owner who was there to accept the item meanwhile :)20:20
amurray:)20:20
amurrayI don't see anything else on the mailing list20:21
amurray#topic Check up on community bugs and techboard bugs20:21
amurray#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community/+bugs?field.assignee=techboard20:21
amurray#link https://bugs.launchpad.net/techboard20:21
amurraynothing new here either20:22
amurray#topic Select a chair for the next meeting (next from https://launchpad.net/~techboard/+members)20:22
amurrayrobie already sent his apologies for the next meeting so will skip him20:22
amurray#agreed next meeting chair: seb128, backup: vorlon20:22
meetingologyAGREED: next meeting chair: seb128, backup: vorlon20:22
seb128+120:22
amurray#topic AOB20:23
seb128none from me20:23
amurraynothing from me either20:23
amurrayok thanks folks20:24
seb128thanks amurray !20:24
amurray#endmeeting20:24
meetingologyMeeting ended at 20:24:51 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2023/ubuntu-meeting.2023-11-21-20.04.moin.txt20:24
sil2100Thanks amurray, seb128  o/20:32
sil2100I go despair a bit more with security-britney20:32
sarnoldcpaelzer: hah, I can't recall seeing "21:18
sarnold`Mattermost` is not a recognized word. (unrecognized-spelling)21:18
sarnoldcpaelzer: sigh stupid firefox .. I can't recall seeing "`Mattermost` is not a recognized word. (unrecognized-spelling)" before! just the non-alpha ones. I'd love to know if it was there and I missed it entirely, or if that error didn't display when I viewed it!21:19

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