[10:27] <laughingtiger> hi, I've got a strange problem. it's that kde systemsettings crashes randomly, sometimes it can be opened three or four times, but mostly it can only be opened once, then after closing it, I couldn't open it anymore.
[10:27] <laughingtiger> and discover too, it crashes randomly
[10:27] <laughingtiger> even in a live system, this happenes.
[10:27] <laughingtiger> happens
[10:28] <laughingtiger> can this be a hardware issue?
[10:29] <laughingtiger> please help me
 you should check your RAM
[10:31] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, so it's either a ram problem, or a motherboard problem? right?
[10:32] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, thank you for clarifying that. I now can be sure to go check the hardware.
 could be software as well. You can open system settings with the terminal command "systemsettings5" and you will probably get error messages printed in terminal if something goes wrong
[10:34] <laughingtiger> wtf, in terminal, everytime it works. typing systemsettings5.
[10:34] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, I'm confused.
 I sometimes experience the same with slack desktop app, refuses to open via software menu but terminal command works without issues
[10:36] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, I see. thank you.
[10:37] <laughingtiger> strange, clicking the systemsettings icon works too everytime now.
[10:37] <laughingtiger> it wasn't like this, a while ago.
[10:39] <laughingtiger> my RAM can't work at designed frequencies under mobo's RAM slot 1 and 3, had to use the mobo's default frequency which is 2400. if I open docp, mobo will restart three times and enter safe mode.
[10:40] <laughingtiger> so it's very much likely to be a hardware malfunction, isn't it?
[10:40] <laughingtiger> somehow the RAM find its way to fit in right now?
 motherboard and ram related issues can be really bizarre so there's a chance that this is indeed either ram or motherboard related. But the packages on your live system could have been damaged or some configuration file could be the cause as well
[10:44] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, I checked the sha256 of the iso file before I burn it into a usb stick.
[10:44] <laughingtiger> so maybe it's not damaged?
 hmm well iso file should be good then, memory stick could have faulty segments or the iso could have ui related packages that misbehave
[10:46] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, erh, what's UI?
 user interface
[10:50] <laughingtiger> oh
[10:52] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, so you think RAM not working under designated frequency with mobo, is a common thing, that I should just ignore it?
[10:53] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, I forgot to mention, I checked both kubuntu iso and debian kde iso, both have the same problems.
 both of them run KDE so both of them could in theory have the same packages and configurations which cause these issues. Did you try to install them and if so did you have the same issues after doing an update?
[10:57] <laughingtiger75> IrcsomeBot, on debian, the problem persists after I installed it
[10:57] <laughingtiger75> and for kubuntu, it's just like I said. it didn't work ,but now it's ok.
 I would resolve the RAM issue in first place
[11:01] <laughingtiger75> IrcsomeBot, hmm, thank you . I'll go check the mobo and RAM later.
 if this was a ram issue, the issues you'd experience would likely be different each time. Anything from complete system crashes to odd behavior in apps. If you keep experiencing the same issue with system settings app, then my guess would be that the code for responsible for either opening system settings, calling system services required for system settings or reading system info is either running to an issue with a configuration file or 
[11:03] <laughingtiger75> IrcsomeBot I see.
 that being said, ram issues are infamous for being difficult to debug and diagnose, so it could have something to do with ram as well
 if the design frequency of a RAM is not met there can be problems with refresh. That means that bits can flip randomly
[11:05] <laughingtiger75> IrcsomeBot, what do you mean refresh?
 Each memory cell of your RAM is basically a very small capacitor. It loses charge constantly and needs to be "refreshed" frequently. Refresh means that the cell is "read" and it's content is written again, so the capacitor is recharged. If that does not happen in time the information may be lost
[11:09] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, I see. thank you for that.
[11:11] <laughingtiger> IrcsomeBot, thank you once again. my network is unstable and I have sth to attend t. so I'll see you.
[11:11] <laughingtiger> attend to
[12:19] <kaj> Hi all
[15:39] <Elliria> Hey there. Is letting this update happen a good idea? I don't see new linux-modules-nvidia- files in the installation list, yet it wants to remove two files like that to install all those others. https://imgur.com/a/ambv9R8
[15:50] <arraybolt3> Elliria: mmm, tough one to answer. Looks like to me it could just be the removal of old kernel stuff, but it *could* go south.
[15:51] <arraybolt3> If it were me personally, I'd take the plunge and try it, but you should be prepared to boot into a CLI and recover if you end up with no working NVIDIA drivers.
[15:51] <Elliria> Yeah, that's what I'm worried about, darn it.
[15:52] <arraybolt3> Can you run `uname -r` in a terminal for me?
[15:52] <arraybolt3> The NVIDIA modules being removed are for kernel 5.15, which is pretty old. I'd expect you to be on kernel 6.5 or newer, and if that's the case then I believe this is safe.
[15:53] <arraybolt3> uname -r will display a line of info about your running kernel.
[15:53] <arraybolt3> Elliria: ^
[15:53] <iomari891> phoenixz: Sorry for the late reply. I'm just seeing your post. YEs I get krunner when I call it. But I don't see the panel. Not even latte-dock. Here is the output when I run plasmashell:  https://pastebin.com/GVCZ5aK3   When I an it, the desktop showed for a split second.
[15:54] <arraybolt3> iomari891: if you don't mind, I'm around and might be able to try and help.
[15:54] <arraybolt3> Looks like you have an out-of-date library some how? "/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qt5/plugins/sqldrivers/libqsqlite.so: undefined symbol: sqlite3_column_table_name16" is probably what's taking out your desktop.
[15:54] <Elliria> 5.15.0-101-generic
[15:54] <arraybolt3> Elliria: oh crud
[15:55] <Elliria> I'm being offered a kernel by the update, but I deselected it and that list is the result.
[15:55] <arraybolt3> yeeeah then that update could go south.
[15:55] <arraybolt3> Still not 100% sure, but just tread cautiously.
[15:56] <arraybolt3> iomari891: are you on Kubuntu? Or is this KDE neon?
[15:56] <Elliria> I added a screenshot of the kernels I'm being offered below that first one at the same link.
[15:57] <Elliria> I always deselect the kernel until after the NVIDIA drivers are updated. If you don't and if the kernel gets installed first, then you have to use the CLI to rescue yourself, so I just force the drivers to happen first.
[15:58] <arraybolt3> those are NVIDIA driver metapackages, not kernels?
[15:58] <iomari891> kubuntu
[15:58] <iomari891> 23.10
[15:58] <arraybolt3> iomari891: oh very strange. OK, well what might fix it is something like this:
[15:58] <Elliria> The linux-modules-nvidia packages are metapackages?
[15:58] <arraybolt3> Elliria: correct
[15:58] <arraybolt3> iomari891: first run `nmtui` so you can connect to the Internet, this is a text-based NetworkManager frontend
[15:59] <Elliria> So, will they be updated even though they're being deleted by the update?
[15:59] <arraybolt3> iomari891: then once you're connected, run `sudo apt update && sudo apt full-upgrade`
[15:59] <arraybolt3> then try running plasmashell again from krunner
[15:59] <arraybolt3> Elliria: No. The packages you're deselecting are metapackages.
[16:00] <iomari891> arraybolt3: I've done that before but I'll try it again now .......
[16:00] <arraybolt3> What's probably happening (this is a guess since I don't know all of the nitty-gritty about the dependencies here) is that deselecting those four packages means that new NVIDIA modules aren't going to be installed.
[16:00] <arraybolt3> Elliria: But for whatever reason, apt sees the old ones as no longer necessary.
[16:00] <Elliria> Ah, okay. Well, I ended up at a black screen and had to rescue myself once upon a long time ago and was told that that happens when the kernel gets updated before the NVIDIA driver, so I always stop the updates to the kernel until after the NVIDIA drivers are updated so that that won't happen again. It's all kinds of annoying to not be allowed to log into your own computer. Heh.
[16:00] <arraybolt3> So what'll happen (again, this is me guessing) is apt will uninstall the old ones, not install the new ones, and you'll be dumped to a CLI on reboot.
[16:01] <arraybolt3> Right - you're deselecting parts of the driver, not the kernel itself.
[16:01] <Elliria> I'd be happier if I saw someone else say, "Oh, yeah, I was offered the same update today and it deleted those and nothing bad happened."
[16:01] <arraybolt3> The kernel packages are named things like "linux-image-6.5.0-25-generic", not "nvidia-kernel-source-XXX"
[16:01] <arraybolt3> nvidia-kernel-source is part of the driver, which is a kernel *module*. That's why "kernel" is in its name.
[16:02] <Elliria> I could just leave everything selected and take my chances, but I don't know if it would just do it or bring me to a similar warning window like the one I pasted into Imgur.
[16:02] <arraybolt3> I'd try installing everything in one go, but then rebuild your DKMS drivers thereafter for good measure.
[16:02] <Elliria> Yeah, you have to make sure the ones with kernel in their name happen last. Apt doesn't control the order they're done in. It's literally a roll of the dice as to whether they'll install in the correct order. I just force it.
[16:03] <arraybolt3> apt is really crud this way sometimes I guess...
[16:04] <Elliria> Yeah. I force the order and I also have a little 3x5 card in a box on my desk that tells me what to do to get back in so that I don't forget. Heh.
[16:04] <arraybolt3> Elliria: Do you see any package called "linux-image-XYZ" in your package list?
[16:05] <arraybolt3> (of packages to upgrade, not packages to remove)
 hi guys
 can i do screen recorde in plasma 5.27.10? with spectacle?
[16:06] <Elliria> No. The only update that starts with linux is linux-signatures-nvidia-5.15.0-101-generic.
[16:07] <Elliria> I'm looking at the list in Discover. Is there a command-line way to print out a list of what would be updated without doing the actual update?
[16:08] <arraybolt3> Elliria: If you don't see any linux-image in your list, you aren't about to get a kernel update.
[16:08] <arraybolt3> So installing everything in one go is likely to work.
[16:08] <Elliria> I use Kazam or Peek for that, IrcsomeBot.
[16:09] <Elliria> Ah, oh, that is very good news, arraybolt3!
[16:10] <Elliria> Should I go for it and just let the whole thing run without deselecting anything?
[16:10] <arraybolt3> I'd try it, yes.
[16:10] <Elliria> Allrighty then. Be back in a bit to report how it turned out, I hope. Heh.
[16:11]  * Elliria heads off to wrestle with dragons...
[16:15] <arraybolt3> any luck?
[16:15] <Elliria> All is well. Thank you so much! It took a while to run, but nothing bad happened.
[16:16] <Elliria> Sometimes you just don't want to take chances alone. Heh.
[16:16] <arraybolt3> Glad to help :)
[16:17] <Elliria> You did great. I also wrote down what you said about the linux-image file so I'll know what to look for next time.
[16:17] <Elliria> They seem to do these updates every couple/few weeks.
[16:17] <arraybolt3> that sounds about right
[16:19] <Elliria> It's always that experience of being locked out of your computer that makes you a bit gun-shy from then on, so now I always am a bit skeptical, especially when there's a huge list like that and some removals.
[16:37] <iomari891> arraybolt3: Ok i'm back after the update. Still no desktop and still the same error when I run plasmashell.
[16:38] <iomari891> THe update did however update the kernel and nvidia drivers.
[20:47] <xrandr> Good afternoon everyone
[22:04] <Kangarooo> why android storage cant be accessed?