[00:38] <lechner> Hi, is there an upgrade path from Ubuntu 8.10 to a version with 'xz', and modern encryption and maybe GRUB 2 on ancient 32-bit equipment (Athlon XP Mobile) that will not boot from USB or CDROM? I have extra partitions.
[00:39] <leftyfb> no
[00:39] <ravage> the last 32bit release is 18.04. but upgrading is .. well.. not impossible. but just dont do it
[00:40] <leftyfb> lechner: 8.10 was a non-LTS from 14 years ago. There is absolutely no advantage in trying to upgrade from something that old
[00:41] <ravage> that computer is ready to be retired.
[00:41] <lechner> leftyfb: i would be happy to install something newer but i have to do it via hard disk (or perhaps TFTP) alone
[00:41] <Unit193> "Don't" is generally the recommendation, if you must, then upgrade release by release until you hit a LTS, then jump from LTS to LTS until 18.04.
[00:42] <Unit193> If you have enough ram, then grml-rescueboot is pretty great, except it needs grub2.
[00:42] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: Do you have any newer system? Your best bet here IMO is to take the drive out, connect it to a different computer, boot that computer from a Lubuntu 18.04 (or better yet, Debian LXDE 32-bit) drive, install onto the drive, then put the drive back into the original system.
[00:42] <leftyfb> Unit193: that would not be an install I would wish on anyone
[00:42] <sarnold> lechner: wow that's a brutal situation :(
[00:42] <ravage> lechner, netboot images for 18.04 are here: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/bionic-updates/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/
[00:42] <Unit193> leftyfb: I did it once a few years back with the last Fluxbuntu release, in a VM just to try it.
[00:43] <lechner> arraybolt3[m]: it's a parallel IDE adapter in a laptop i have never seen before
[00:43] <leftyfb> jeeze
[00:43] <leftyfb> why bother?
[00:43] <ravage> burn it
[00:43] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: Actually, netboot isn't a bad idea. If you can TFTP boot netboot.xyz, you can install a 32-bit version of Debian most likely.
[00:44] <arraybolt3[m]> ravage: We're Linux. We like resurrecting old computers.
[00:44] <arraybolt3[m]> leftyfb: Because we can.
[00:44] <lechner> when did Ubuntu stop shipping the odd CDROM Atapi drivers, please?
[00:44] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: https://netboot.xyz/docs/booting/tftp
[00:44] <Unit193> For 32bit, I would encourage you to go to Debian, yeah.
[00:45] <lechner> i would just use debootstrap but the 8.10 archive is long gone
[00:45] <leftyfb> arraybolt3[m]: there's old, then there's "the only reason to do this is because it's fun and I want to learn something" at which point, you are basically on your own
[00:45] <Unit193> !eolupgrades
[00:45] <ubottu> End-Of-Life is when security updates and support for an Ubuntu release stop. Make sure to update Ubuntu before it goes EOL so you get updates promptly for newly-discovered security vulnerabilities. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOL and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases for more info. Looking to upgrade from an EOL release? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
[00:45] <arraybolt3[m]> leftyfb: Ubuntu 18.04 is still supported. If we're true to our word, he's not on his own.
[00:46] <leftyfb> arraybolt3[m]: he's running 8.10
[00:46] <Unit193> arraybolt3[m]: Then even after that, one could get free ESM (for up to 3 systems)
[00:46] <leftyfb> lechner: WAIT. Are you in the Boston area?
[00:47] <lechner> leftyfb: sorry, that was in college :)
[00:47] <leftyfb> damn. I would give you a new PC that'll run 64bit
[00:47] <leftyfb> well, not new
[00:48] <ravage> leftyfb is just Oprah is disguise
[00:49] <arraybolt3[m]> leftyfb: One of my ancient systems had a very practical use (an ancient XP desktop that was able to help me take a disk image of a critically important Win2K system).
[00:49] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: The problem with installing from netboot is that the whole installer image would have to fit in your system's RAM. How much RAM do you have?
[00:49] <lechner> 768MB
[00:50] <lechner> i knew it would be an unpopular topic (and thank you for your empathy, leftyfb, i have some more recent equipment).
[00:50] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: Yeah, that's not too old to be hopeless.
[00:50] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: I have dealt with so many ancient computers. I think this is a great project.
[00:51] <lechner> my neighbor threw out a laptop with the screen ripped off. it would be a nice Zoom station for my family
[00:51] <lechner> well, not Zoom, but you get the idea
[00:51] <leftyfb> lechner: you're not running zoom on that
[00:51] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: So why exactly could you not boot from CDROM?
[00:51] <leftyfb> you're lucky to play video, let alone stream it
[00:51] <sarnold> lechner: if there's a reason why you're aiming for a machine without debian, you could also try https://www.adelielinux.org/download/ -- I've heard the maintainer really intends to keep supporting 32 bit x86 as long as they can
[00:52] <lechner> i think it's the old ATAPI drivers, but in fairness i did not try the latest Ubuntu (only the latest Guix)
[00:53] <lechner> leftyfb: you are probably right about the video. i am too optimistic sometimes
[00:53] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: One problem is that, with as little RAM as you have, Ubuntu 18.04 probably isn't going to work. I think Debian is your best hope.
[00:54] <lechner> what
[00:54] <lechner> what is Ubuntu shipping?
[00:54] <ravage> xubuntu 18.04 maybe
[00:54] <ravage> i would not try full gnome on that
[00:54] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: I think 18.04 need 1GB or so.
[00:55] <ravage> if you want to watch videos on that thing there is an ascii plugin for mplayer i think
[00:55] <lechner> that's funny!
[00:56] <lechner> sorry to bother everyone. i have been milking a lot of old equipment lately. my biggest issue has been energy consumption generally
[00:56] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: I've had no problems watching videos on XP desktops - they weren't in 1080p or anything, but a DVD? Sure.
[00:56] <lechner> the processor also does not have the modern hash instructions
[00:56] <ravage> those old CPUs keep you warm in winter for sure
[00:57] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: I think it's a great idea, though.
[00:57] <lechner> unfortunately, i am in california
[00:57] <ravage> oh. it does not provide water. sorry :)
[00:58] <sarnold> re ascii output: mplayer -vo aa _-5dEyAzu3Nww.mkv
[00:58] <lechner> we would be okay if they did not use ninety percent of our water to grow almonds or avocadoes
[00:58] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: Well, here's a possibly silly idea. Boot from a really old Linux ISO that does provide the old drivers, then use dd to flash a fully installed image to your old system.
[00:59] <ravage> sarnold, nice. let me watch something :D
[00:59] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: You can make the image in a VM on a newer computer, then flash it to the drive of the older computer.
[00:59] <lechner> arraybolt3[m]: i have 8.10 on the hard disk, and three empty partitions
[00:59] <lechner> but the browser cannot do modern encryption
[01:00] <lechner> and there is no xz
[01:00] <lechner> except for mozilla or google, i can't even read the internet
[01:00] <arraybolt3[m]> lechner: Yeah. So just go to a newer system, fire up QEMU with a 32-bit ISO file and a raw virtual drive, install the distro of your choice, then copy it to a USB, take it to the old system, flash it to the HDD, and you're good to go. (That's a basic idea, you'd have to fill in the rest.)
=== synapt is now known as nate