snap-lI don't have raring installed. Is that a Flash plugin problem?00:04
jsjgruber-x-rsnap-l, no, believe it or not flash circumvents it in other programs, but I don't think epiphany uses flash without taking special action. Epiphany crashes with or without flash installed.00:17
snap-lNot sure then. I haven't touched Epiphany in years00:19
=== Thirtysixway_ is now known as Thirtysixway
snap-lMeeting in 10 minutes01:51
gamerchick02i'm actually here. ahem.01:52
gamerchick02irony: sitting in ubuntu-us-mi on the mac. hah01:52
waldo323the mac is running ubuntu, right? ;)01:56
gamerchick02no it is not. OSX.02:00
snap-lone minute to meeting02:00
gamerchick02the desktop runs Ubuntu.02:00
snap-lOK, let's get started02:00
snap-lfirst off, welcome to the March meeting for Ubuntu US MI02:00
snap-lWe're nearing the end of the Ubuntu Global Jam02:00
snap-lI'd like to thank everyone who participated02:01
snap-land remind folks that there's still time to participate if you haven't already. ;)02:01
snap-lWe had a pretty respectable turnout on some of the events02:02
snap-lDo you all think this was a worthwhile way to do this, or would you prefer something a little more in-person?02:02
gamerchick02i think it's worthwhile. i was just away all weekend.02:02
snap-lyeah, this weekend wasn't the greatest for me as far as participation02:03
snap-lhad family over on Saturday02:03
jjessehello :)02:03
snap-lhowdy jjesse02:04
waldo323me too, does this meeting count as participating ? :)02:04
gamerchick02hi jjesse02:04
snap-lwaldo323: No. ;)02:04
gamerchick02i was up north in saginaw and taking care of Nile stuff and went shopping today (which now that i say it sounds like a lame excuse, whoops)02:04
snap-lNo worries.02:05
snap-lI do think though that the online participation allows folks to take advantage of their weird windows of time02:05
gamerchick02you are correct.02:05
snap-lI also was pretty pleased with how well the Google Hangouts worked.02:06
waldo323it is nice to have in person options when they are possible02:06
snap-lRight, but I think the in-person stuff might be better for teh release parties02:06
snap-lThe jams, frankly, have been pretty poorly attended02:06
snap-lthough it does give people a place to head to instead of just blowing the whole thing off completely.02:06
snap-lAnywho, it's something to think about for our next Jam, and for any events we might plan in the future02:09
snap-lI think we'll have more acceptance after the UDS02:09
snap-lat least we'll have a bit better roadmap02:10
snap-lAnd remember: there's still time to participate. :)02:11
snap-lBig thanks to jcastro for hanging out and talking about AskUbuntu02:11
snap-lI got some extra reputation from his tips02:12
gamerchick02that's sweet02:12
snap-lIf you haven't checked out askubuntu.com yet, I'd encourage you to check it out.02:13
snap-lIt's awesome.02:13
gamerchick02it is.02:13
snap-lAnything else on the jam?02:15
jjessedid anyone get ubuntu touch to work?02:15
jjessemine (through MultRom) just boots to a blank screen02:15
snap-lYeah, Mark Thomas got it working, as did jcastro02:15
snap-lThey're using Nexus 7 devices.02:15
gamerchick02i'm afraid to install it to my Nexus 7.02:16
jjessehrmm yeah on my Nexus 7 running MultiRom to boot both Android and Ubuntu just gets a blank screen02:16
jjessei'll have to bug #ubuntu-touch some more02:16
snap-lYeah, it appears it can work. :)02:17
snap-lDId anyone else play with touch over the weekned?02:18
gamerchick02no but i probably should try to install it to my old android phone. has anyone tried it on an LG Optimus V?02:19
snap-lI haven't.02:19
jjessethere i a list of supported devices02:19
jjesseand more are added all the time02:19
gamerchick02i'll check it out. thanks.02:19
waldo323just found instructions for my old phone02:20
waldo323(htc incredible)02:20
snap-lAnything else on touches or jams?02:21
snap-lor touching jams?02:21
gamerchick02my mom made jam and it's in our basement02:22
jjesseis it good jam?  what flavor?  i like strawberry02:24
gamerchick02strawberry and blueberry.02:24
gamerchick02well, seperate jars for each.02:24
snap-lOK, going to move along to the Release party02:26
snap-lWe have our location at Penguicon 2013.02:27
snap-lPerhaps you might have heard of it. :)02:27
gamerchick02never in my life. :-P02:27
jjesseis there were a bunch of penguins get together?02:28
snap-lYes, dressed as people and other furry animals02:28
snap-lThe release party will be on Friday, from 7-8pm02:28
snap-lWe'll be meeting in our usual spot of "the hotel bar"02:28
gamerchick02beer + Linux = happy geeks02:29
snap-lAnd we'll celebrate the release of Raring Ringtail02:29
waldo323it is a nice open area02:29
snap-lwaldo323: so I've heard.02:29
snap-lI put in the request for some swag for the event02:30
snap-lWe'll see if it will be granted.02:30
snap-lOnly downside is you'll need to have at least a one-day ticket for Penguicon02:30
snap-lBut Penguicon is definitely an event that should not be missed02:31
waldo323the hotel block they currently have is 75% full02:32
waldo323so if you plan on staying it would be a good idea to reserve your room soon02:33
gamerchick02pardon me but *FLAIL*02:33
gamerchick02that's like DOWN THE ROAD FROM MY APARTMENT02:33
waldo323heh well i did include an if02:33
gamerchick02i know but i just looked at the location and almost fell off the couch02:34
waldo323oh yikes, be safe02:34
snap-lI'd encourage everyone to attend02:35
gamerchick02hah. i might be able to if i can get Friday off02:35
snap-lIt's going on all weekend02:36
snap-l$50 for the weekend02:36
snap-lAlso, if you want a great audience for a talk, you'll want to talk with the programming folks to get yourself on the event list02:37
gamerchick02that's not bad at all. how late does the event run each night?02:38
snap-lIt's one of the highlights of my convention year.02:38
snap-lIt runs all night02:38
gamerchick02uhm, wow, ok. i'm more of a "morning person" you could say...02:39
snap-lSunday everyone runs out of gas, but it is litterally all night02:39
waldo323and there are talks and events in the mornings too02:39
gamerchick02would i miss a ton if i went home at midnight?02:39
waldo323not a lot of programming typically happens after midnight you'd miss some of the parties and socializing that happens after that time02:40
snap-lgamerchick02: You'd have to check the program02:40
snap-lBut yeah, most of it is just the parties and such02:40
gamerchick02thanks i will02:40
snap-land the "after dark" stuff that isn't terribly minor friendly.02:41
waldo323my first year i went home each night and didn't know i missed anything02:41
snap-lYeah, our first year we went home. Afterward we decided to just get a hotel room02:41
waldo323i hope there will be some late night computer talks this year02:41
snap-land I'm cheap02:41
gamerchick02well, it is literally down the road from me. 10 minutes.02:42
gamerchick02i live kind of across from Oakland University ish02:42
waldo323makes sense to sleep in your own bed in that case02:42
snap-lAnywho, that's what's happening for the release party in this area02:46
snap-lIf you want to organize your own release party, please feel free02:46
snap-lPost to the mailing list and get something organized02:46
gamerchick02i'm thinking i'll try to make time for this. considering it's right down the street and all.02:46
snap-lHey rick_h_!02:51
snap-lHow was the trip?02:51
rick_h_good, little black ice scare in KY but survived and made it down02:51
rick_h_just got back from dinner, of course in the south everything is closed on a sunday night :/02:51
snap-lSo, how was the 7-11?02:53
waldo323i found a patch of black ice on I75 somewhere between 11 and 14 mile today , glad you're safe rick_h_02:53
rick_h_snap-l: heh, chilis...almost as bad02:53
snap-lHey, nothing wrong with Chili's, unless they don't know what they're doing02:54
gamerchick02chili's isn't too bad.02:54
snap-llike the one at Oakland Mall02:54
rick_h_waldo323: yea, there was a spot where the hwy did a bunch of intersections and overpasses and I guess the wind must go through there funny. Aroud 12 different cars in accidents in a 1mi stretch on both sides of the hwy02:54
gamerchick02eeee. glad you're safe, rick_h_02:54
waldo323oh wow02:54
rick_h_felt the suv slide around on me a twice in there but not too bad02:54
rick_h_but was stuck at 0mph for around 25min while they cleared things up and then of course you're looking like a hawk for any sort of black ice for the next 4hrs02:55
gamerchick02i'm still glad you're ok. that's a scare.02:57
rick_h_yea, all good. the new car got me down nice and safe. Was bummed to not cross 30mpg though02:58
rick_h_and finding diesel is fun :)02:58
rick_h_not as simple as you initially think02:58
gamerchick02oh yeah you have the diesal VW yes?02:58
rick_h_fortunately it's 750mi trip and got right aroud 725 miles on a tank02:58
rick_h_gamerchick02: yea, TDI ftw02:58
gamerchick02i'd love a TDI anything, but not a lot of diesal chryslers to be found. they're making a diesal RAM 1500 but i don't really want a huge truck.02:59
rick_h_they're adding a diesel jeep cherokee this fall03:00
rick_h_was at the auto show and I thought about looking at it to compre03:00
rick_h_but yea, not a lot out there03:00
gamerchick02i don't work on the Cherokee so i didn't really know, whoops03:00
snap-lWhoops. Got sidetracked. :)03:02
gamerchick02we did, sorry03:02
snap-lAnything else forthe meeting? If not, meeting adjourned. :)03:02
gamerchick02do you have a gavel?03:02
rick_h_oh sorry, missed I jumped into the meeting, my bad03:02
snap-lrick_h_: No worries. :)03:02
snap-lwe be jammin;03:02
gamerchick02that's actually perfect because i need to go to bed. stupid need for more than 6 hours sleep. getting old kills you.03:03
snap-lYeah, tell me about it. ;)03:03
waldo323i refuse to get old03:03
waldo323not sure it is working though03:04
gamerchick02i used to be able to go to bed at midnight and get up at 6:30 for 5 days, then sleep midnight to 9 on weekends and be fine. now… not so much.03:04
gamerchick02well, it's either get old or get dead and i'd rather get old i guess.03:04
rick_h_droidwoot, bluetooth keyboard for the tablet03:04
rick_h_droidbut isn't not mechanical :(03:05
snap-lrick_h_droid: Yeah, that' can be a bummer03:05
rick_h_droidheh, now need a stand though. Not exactly ergo with it laying down on the table03:06
gamerchick02ok, i'm going to read a bit then go to bed. sorry i didn't jam with everyone. i'll see you all this week after work, methinks. :)03:06
gamerchick02lol rick_h_droid03:06
rick_h_droidgamerchick night, have fun03:06
snap-lHanging out if anyone wants to join03:09
snap-lHope you all have a great night!04:10
brouschhow went the jamming?13:06
snap-lIt went OK. Not as much turnout as I would have hoped, but I think part of it is people are just busy on weekends13:13
snap-land being online was both a blessing and a curse13:13
snap-lblessing: Allowed people to take advantage of weird windows of time throughout the weekend13:13
snap-lcurse: No focus13:14
snap-lAlso I think having jcastro's Q&A at 11am on a Saturday was too early for anyone to really participate.13:14
snap-lAnd it could have been promoted better, though not sure exactly how13:15
snap-lbut overall I think it was good.13:15
snap-lI think it'll take some getting used to for folks to really participate13:15
snap-land some more focused events13:15
snap-llike "hey, we're really jamming in a hangout from X to Y"13:16
brouschSorry I had no time13:21
snap-lbrousch: That's OK.13:24
snap-lNot complaining. People are just busy on the weekends. :)13:25
brouschMy talk went well, though I think it was the least-attended talk at the conference14:00
snap-lbrousch: What talk were you opposite?14:03
snap-lbrousch: BTW: How was the conference?14:03
brouschI was opposite 3 talks I wanted to see14:03
snap-lThat could be a problem. :)14:04
brouschIt definitely was14:04
brouschMost of my friends went to other talks because they know they will see mine some other day14:05
brouschThe conference was good14:05
jrwren_did you see Jeff McWherter's talk?14:37
brouschI don't think so14:38
brouschI assumed it was PHoneGap14:39
jrwren_it might have been.14:49
jrwren_i know they use that a lot14:49
jrwren_he left early to have dinner with me that night :)14:49
jrwren_i stole a grdevday speaker :)14:49
brouschHe missed the Github drinkup afterwards14:57
brouschWe were squashed into a tiny space, but free beer!14:57
brouschSo I hope you paid for his beer14:58
jrwren_i didn't. he paid for mine, :)15:03
jrwren_he has a 1yo, I think he was more running home to see her.15:03
jrwren_how was the drunkup? lots of githubbers there?15:03
brouschNo. We only have one githubber in GR now15:09
brouschBy Githubber, i mean an employee of GitHub15:10
jrwren_only one now? did someone move?15:11
jrwren_i think I only ever knew of one.15:11
jrwren_otehr MI peeps were port huron area IIRC15:11
jrwren_and somewhere south of GR, like Kzoo15:11
jrwren_something like that, but I don't remember15:11
brouschA company in Holland got bought by GitHub a year or so ago so we had more. Some of them moved to California15:13
jrwren_Holland is what I was thinking of (south of GR) :)15:13
brouschThat company had people in holland and South Bend, IN15:13
brouschWell, it's SW of GR, on The LAke15:13
brouschgreg-g: I'm tired of your bicycling-induced heavy breathing causing global warming. Drive a car! http://science.slashdot.org/story/13/03/04/1238258/state-rep-says-biking-is-not-earth-friendly-because-breathing-produces-co215:46
snap-lI think we need a Mythbusters episode on this15:51
snap-lI foresee several trips to the junkyard, and special guest appearance by Lance Armstrong15:52
snap-lThen at the end they can detonate both the car and Lance Armstrong15:52
snap-land thus global warming is saved.15:52
brouschOr they could do it in one of the emissions test labs15:53
brouschHave man and machine go for 24 hours in there and see who produces more waste/mile15:54
greg-gbrousch: wow, thanks for my daily dose of bike craziness16:17
snap-lI hope I hear from Elite Keyboards today.16:17
snap-lI'll be exceptionally angry if I don't.16:17
rick_h_greg-g: can you post your laptop experience to https://plus.google.com/115383915302515672680/posts/Y9oANWcDGg8 ?16:19
snap-lrick_h_: I posted as well16:22
snap-lMy experience: You'll eventually buy a Thinkpad. The question is how many machines will you buy in the interim.16:22
rick_h_snap-l: thanks16:22
rick_h_yea, the first comment hosed on thinkpads and I'm having a hard time not going "BS!"16:23
snap-lAgain, you'll eventually buy Thinkpad. The question is when. ;)16:25
greg-grick_h_: done16:26
greg-grick_h_: clincher: "Thinkpads are the computers you buy when you want something that is strong and durable. Apple is what you buy when you want pretty looking hardware (ignoring software differences). Dells are this stupid in between that doesn't work for me."16:26
rick_h_greg-g: thank you much16:27
rick_h_co-worker there so I don't want him to get a sucky machine16:27
snap-lAPparently the phishers are strong today16:28
greg-gwho is that , btw?16:28
rick_h_greg-g: he's on a launchpad squad working on cloud stuff now16:28
rick_h_so guess cloud engineering squad16:29
greg-gjrwren_: I'm not sold on the purely calorie burning argument for walking desks. But after this Berkeley prof presented here at WMF (she's the author of "The Chair") I'm sold on the general health issues of sitting all day, especially in the posture we are told is "correct".16:29
greg-grick_h_: gotcha16:30
rick_h_greg-g: interesting16:31
snap-lSo what's the correct position?16:31
greg-gwell, one of two16:31
snap-lfirst person to say "missionary" gets a boot to the hed.16:31
greg-glemme find some pictures16:31
snap-lAlso a little bummed. Found out Logitech laid off one of the royal smart people on the Squeezebox project16:32
greg-gthis one is considered to be just about up there: http://www.focaluprightfurniture.com/video-demos/16:33
snap-lit's a matter of time until mysqueezebox.com goes poof.16:33
greg-gone thing Galen stessed: there is no good ONE position, our bodies are made to move, so, change it up through out the day16:33
snap-lYeah, that's one thing the ergo chairs don't handle very well16:33
greg-gwell, the point is one chair can't do it all16:34
greg-gthat chair is pretty good, it pivots around16:34
greg-gyou can shimmy your tooshie16:34
snap-lWonder if the ball chair is helping any16:35
snap-lor if that's just something they can glom onto16:35
snap-lIt makes sense that sitting all day can't be all that good for you16:35
snap-lIt there's probably some nuances that get lost in the re-telling16:36
snap-lUsually how scientific research works16:36
snap-lYes, this is mostly true, but...16:36
snap-land the but contains all of the nuance that doesn't make it out past the papers16:37
greg-gwhich is why most of science journalism sucks16:37
snap-lFind that a lot in health journalism16:38
snap-l"science says eating bacon improves health"16:38
snap-lNo, science says bacon has a protein that if synthesized properly has been shown in one uncontrolled study to...16:39
greg-gbtw, xkcd today made me lol in the office16:39
snap-lYeah, unless my client automatically checks, I'm never checking the sig16:40
greg-gthank you, mutt16:41
snap-lSadly I think I need those signs16:42
greg-grick_h_: we won! (g+ thinkin discussion)17:28
jrwren_greg-g: i miss my standing desk :)17:28
greg-gjrwren_: yeah, I want to try one out17:28
jrwren_snap-l: I totally agree.17:28
jrwren_if there is anything I know, is that health professionals are as trust worthy as lawyers.17:28
jrwren_the best thing is to do your own research adn come to your own conclusions.17:29
jrwren_health professionals are the idiots that told us no red meat and that fat intake is bad 20-30 yrs ago.17:29
jrwren_now we have obesity epedemic and hearth disease is more prevelant.17:29
rick_h_greg-g: woot!17:36
dzho"health professionals" is a pretty broad brush17:40
dzholumping together CSPI with, say, the pediatrician's nurse is sort of like lumping together, oh, Bill Gates and the clerk at Best Buy17:41
dzhoand yet both of the former fall into the "health professionals" category, and the latter as IT professionals.17:41
jrwren_its what I like about broad generalizations... usually tehy are false, in this case, I believe it true.17:45
dzhooh, well, that's ok, then.17:49
rick_h_whoa https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2013-March/036776.html17:58
snap-lOh FFS17:59
snap-lI think they're too ambitious in their timeline18:01
snap-lThough it's nice to see X support will still be around18:01
snap-lWelcome to the divergence from GNOME18:03
snap-lI'm not sure that's a bad thing overall18:04
jrwren_could be great.18:04
jrwren_wayland or whatever suffered from design by commitee IMO18:04
snap-lI'm not sure this is immune18:05
jrwren_single org at least18:05
jjessewell it will be designed by canonical an then thrown over the wall as being developed in an open and transparent way18:05
jrwren_likely with commercial requirements, not academic18:05
jrwren_if this fails, so does canonicals industry direction18:05
snap-lI hope they keep the spirit of X though, or it's not going to get adoption outside of Canonical18:06
snap-l(client display anywhere with minimal effort)18:06
jrwren_i don't like the reasoning18:07
jrwren_in fact, I claim it a lie.18:07
jrwren_"users nowadays expect a more consistent and a more integrated user experience than what is possible to offer on top of the X window system"18:07
jrwren_this is absolutely false.18:08
jrwren_if that is their reasoning, they are stupid.18:08
snap-lThe X stack is not designed for performance, though18:08
jcastrohwo can you know the reasoning? There's like 5 pages of specs and I am barely through the first 2!18:08
snap-land certainly not for 3D performance18:08
jrwren_i really do not like tehat one sentence. yes, I'm bitching about one sentence.18:08
snap-lWhich is why compiz can be such a sore spot18:09
jrwren_everything else in the Motivation section is great, and I love this.18:09
snap-lI think the real message is clear: KDE won. ;)18:11
snap-lNow I'll have to fucking learn QT.18:11
jjesse+1 to snap-l18:11
jjessejust switch to Kubuntu and you will be happy18:11
* brousch high-fives jjesse18:11
* jjesse high-fives back brousch 18:11
snap-lScrew that. I'm getting an abacus and a tree stump18:11
jcastrosnap-l: KDE didn't win, Qt won. :)18:12
snap-ly'all are crazy.18:12
jrwren_QT is awesome.18:12
jrwren_google earth uses QT on all platforms.18:12
snap-lI think it's more accurate to say GNOME lost their minds18:12
jrwren_that is true too.18:13
jrwren_gnome should have quit as soon as QT fixed their license :p18:13
snap-ljrwren_: har har18:13
snap-lI think the real problem is GNOME's pursut of some notional user who never learns how to use a computer18:14
snap-land wants one button in the middle of their screen that says "do what I mean, poorly"18:14
slestakat the detriment of those who can use their machines18:15
jcastromeh, there's nothing you can do in GNOME2 that GNOME3 does better.18:15
jcastrowait, did that come out right?18:15
snap-ljcastro: No18:16
snap-ljcastro: 3 years ago you would have verbally abused someone who said that. :)18:16
snap-lIn fact, I think you did. :)18:16
jcastrolet me rephrase18:16
snap-lat Penguicon18:16
jcastroGNOME3 does everything GNOME2 can do but better.18:17
jcastroJust because you suck at learning new things doesn't mean it sucks. :p18:17
snap-lAnd because they feel I can't have nice things doesn't mean it sucks18:17
jrwren_i like the way gtk# has approached the issue :)18:17
snap-lI love configuring everything via gconf18:17
snap-lIt reminds me of this other operating system... I can't recall what it was, but they had this thing called a "registry"18:18
snap-lbut not like a registry where you would get things for your baby or newlyweds18:18
jcastroPutting settings in keys/values is the only sane way to do it18:19
jcastrohow would you do it?18:19
snap-lmore like a place where you took a sledgehammer to a faberge egg to see what was inside.18:19
jcastroIf you say text files I will punch you18:19
snap-lWell, we used to have control panels that had options for setting icon sizes and fonts18:19
brouschIn a lovely settings window easily accessibly from your program18:19
snap-lnow we have registry entries18:19
jcastroyou can make control panels18:20
snap-lI can also make messes with faberge eggs18:20
jcastrono you can't, you can't touch a faberge egg, they're priceless18:20
jcastroand behind bulletproof glass18:20
jcastro(I asked at the Faberge exhibit @ the DIA)18:20
jrwren_gconf registry IS text files... just xml text files :p18:20
snap-ljrwren_: +18:21
jcastrothat's all gone now though18:21
jrwren_it is?18:21
jcastroit's a key/value pair in gsettings or somesuch18:21
snap-land honestly the gconf thing is a red herring. It's not bad in aggregate. Just a pain to have to dive in there to change something that was simple to change before18:21
jcastroor you could you know, just use your computer. :p18:22
snap-lLike having to do about:config to turn off cookies18:22
jrwren_they just need some nice cmdline kvp manipulation commands for changing them and it would be all good, a lot like old apple netinfo :p18:22
jcastrodesktops are to show apps and get out of the way, if you're sitting there all day messing with your desktop settings then seriously, get to work18:22
jcastro(the lack of a font dialog is bs though, that should be in there."18:23
snap-ljcastro: It's a papercut. most of the time I don't fiddle with my desktop, but if I want to make a change, I'd like to get in and get out18:23
jcastrojrwren_: NO, YOU SUCK. 99 PIXELS! NOT 100!18:23
snap-lIt's like having to reset your car firmare to reset the presets on the radio18:23
jrwren_jcastro: LOL18:25
jrwren_but I'm really glad I can't change engine calibration settings on my ECM18:25
snap-ljrwren_: And there's a nice port for changing them should you want to while driving18:25
jrwren_ODB? oh HELL nO.18:26
jrwren_gconf is WAY more complex than ODB :p18:26
snap-lI'm not saying it should be easy to blitz my desktop environment, I'm saying there's certain fit and finish things that should be easier to do18:26
jrwren_err OBD18:26
jrwren_in all honestly, i don't care.18:27
snap-lie: move the seat, mirrors, radio presets, temperature controls18:27
jrwren_i don't care about this at all.18:27
jrwren_if I cared, I'd write software to do what I want :)18:27
brouschjrwren_: Do you know Mark Stanislav?19:00
jrwren_name sounds familiar19:01
jrwren_i think i've met him, but its been years since we've talked19:01
brouschSecurity guy at Networks Group19:02
brouschOK. He gave a talk at GRDevDay and we're having him out next month for web security day at GRWebDev19:02
snap-lIs he a prof at Eastern Michigan?19:19
brouschsnap-l: EMU is listed in his "Education" section on linkedin, but I assume he was a student19:23
snap-lHe apparently has a "rate my professor" page.19:23
brouschWait, adjunct lecturer 2009-201119:23
snap-lYay new keyboard is on it's way.21:07
rick_h_ snap-l yay21:11
snap-lYeah, saves me from making a separate Amazon order21:13
snap-lfor a Filco21:13
kingklickwhatsup everyone long time no talk....this is visualassassin, had to change name22:26
kingklickhave a homework question...shell scripting, cant figure it out for the life of me22:31
Blazeixkingklick: go ahead and ask the question22:57
kingklicki have to write a program to get two numbers from a user and calculate the first number times the second number and show the result. I can only use one loop and the addition operator (+)...cannot use multiplication. I understand what I am supposed to do just dont know how to write it.22:59
Blazeixwhat do you have so far? you can use http://pastebin.com/ to share your script23:06
kingklicki really have nothing....our teacher thinks we are all programmers and tells us if we dont know than google it....well ive been googling for 3 hours and have come up with nothing23:09
kingklickthis is an intro class and noone in the class has ANY programming background23:09
Blazeixwhat sort of loops have you talked about in class?23:21
Blazeixor what sort of loop do you want to use23:21
kingklickfor loops and while loops.....see i dont know, our teacher never really touched on the reasons why u need to use a certain one and what criteria makes using one better than the other23:22
Blazeixok, so i'd start out by making a for loop that just prints out numbers from 1 to 10. that's a good starting point23:24
Blazeixnext i'd try to make my script accept user input, and print out the numbers from 1 to the user-input-number.23:24
kingklickok, i can echo statements and read the user input...im okay at doing that. I know i can take those two numbers and perform a calculation to get the product without multiplying. Just dont know how to write it in code23:26
greg-gtry the first step type thing Blazeix suggested23:28
greg-gjust write something that prints 1 to 10 in a loop23:28
greg-gthen, from there, you can modify that to do other things, but the basic framework is done23:28
greg-gwhat language, btw?23:29
kingklickshell scripting in vi23:29
kingklickif it is considered a certain language i have no clue....teacher never told us23:29
Blazeixkingklick: using the term 'bash' might help you in your googling23:31
kingklickappreciate it guys, ill do what i can.23:36
Blazeixno problem, feel free to ask us any other questions23:36
kingklickwill do23:37
jrwren_poor guy.23:45
kingklickjrwren:  who me?23:52
kingklickha....y do u say that?23:53
jrwren_because you sound so lost and yet you have this task to do.23:54
kingklickyeah that pretty much sums it up lol. Noone had ANY of the homework done for last week. The teacher had to pretty much explain how to do every single program because nobody understood23:55
jrwren_sounds like a bunch of lazy students :p23:56
jrwren_what kind of class is it?23:56
kingklickim a web design guy, not a programmer. And i only know so much about linux. Yeah well that goes without saying. It is college so ppl have jobs and kids. Intro to linux/unix23:56
jrwren_ah, college, so an instructor.23:57
jrwren_its college, the point of college is to teach yourself.23:57
jrwren_that said: IME math adn computer instructors are the worst at explaining the point of things.23:58
kingklickthat seems like an oxymoron. What is the point of paying to go to college to have the instructors work for you, if you have to teach yourself. That is there job, to teach us. Self-research and studying is also good too, but seems redundant23:59
jrwren_let me guess: this is community college?23:59
kingklickbusiness college23:59

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